Topic

Locking down tower items and obvious theft

I know this has been done to death and rant in haste as they say.....

i spent ages workingon making my tower look like i wanted - mainly because i enjoy the artistic side of creating spaces and also because i love that people come and see them (the pool is still VERY popular btw!!)

i worked on putting together a hell themed room with the help of the amazing Atlantis (thanks again hun) and spent ages adjusting items so that i got the desired effect of owls in spooky trees.

to complete this - i laid out some skull stools and a witches cauldron - however i obviously forgot to put the cauldron down in decorate mode.  Very long story slightly shorter - the cauldron has been taken.

OK heres the thing - every other item in the tower is locked down so the person who took it must have gone from floor to floor systematically seeing what they can steal - it must have taken them ages!!!! 

its really simple - if an item in my tower has a price on it - you have an option to own it - if it doesnt then ITS NOT YOURS!

personally i think all items placed in towers and house should only be accessible to owners but i know that debate has been done to death.  Ive played this long enough to know the reality and the comments that will follow but actually just wanted to vent.
 

Posted 3 months ago by Loupin Subscriber! | Permalink

Replies

  • It is an awful feeling to have stuff pinched. Sorry to hear that Loupin:(

    Things are certainly not 100% safe when placed in decorate mode and it has been a known bug for a while now.  Items that can't be picked up by one person can be picked up by another.

    I always let people know if there is something with the verb pick up in the tower when it should be locked. Personally I decided after all my stuff was pinched in the first week that I wouldn't place anything of any value until there is a guarantee that the item is locked and/or there is a built in lock in functionality.

    Please don't let this experience dissuade you from any future art exhibits as I for one am a big fan of the shelf art movement.  
    Posted 3 months ago by Cleops Subscriber! | Permalink
  • People like leaving stuff out for others though.
    Posted 3 months ago by shhexy corin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Loupin wrote
    its really simple - if an item in my tower has a price on it - you have an option to own it - if it doesnt then ITS NOT YOURS!

    The problem here is I put things down for people to just take.
    Posted 3 months ago by IrenicRhonda Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I put some items (gassifier, tongs, smelter, grinder) on the floor of the machine room in my tower for the express purpose of people borrowing them and then replacing them after use.  I did this as a courtesy to visitors, & I clearly stated this on my note pole.  They have all been taken, & I will not be replacing them.
    Posted 3 months ago by Berry Goode Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Items on floors can be taken - they are NEVER locked down. This is by design, so people can give things away if they wish.
    Items "placed" from inventory onto furniture (NOT dropped, and NOT dragged up from the floor even if it says 'place') are locked in place. 
    For a while, any type of bag, including toolboxes, spice racks, element bags, etc. were NOT locked even when placed. I *think* this has been fixed now, but I have not tested it.
    Posted 3 months ago by Zany Serendipity Subscriber! | Permalink
  • well good we can all share views, i completely disagree and think that i should be able to lock down items in my tower (which i can with decorate of course) - if i wanted to give stuff away i would, and do, give it in person or leave it laying around somewhere.  great and pleased for all those that do give away and glad you have the choice .  its just a shame there are a minority of robbing tossers who will jump on the opportunity to steal stuff if ive made the simple mistake of not being in decorate mode.  
    Posted 3 months ago by Loupin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "Place" being a bit erratic is something that they need to fix if it's still broken, obviously.  Assuming that wasn't the case here... 

    It is a shame, but it's the way it is  - there's no way for the game to know if you've done something by mistake or on purpose.

    As you say, this has been done to death,  yet still people expect things not to be taken when they leave them on the floor (accidentally or on purpose).

    You made a mistake, someone took advantage of that, knowingly or unknowingly. 

    Not using the tools available to do what you want to do doesn't mean that another tool should be re-purposed to do what you meant to do. 
    Posted 3 months ago by shhexy corin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Gah, can we once admit that the person who went through the entire tower searching for one thing that wasn't nailed down was not thinking that Loupin left out a free cauldon, amid all the other locked down stuff.

    I understand that some very kind Glitch leave out goodies for people. I do too but I usually leave a note letting them know, so that the shy Glitch feel confidant about picking it up. (I still want a freebie basket- an universal symbol for freebies)

    We all want to see pretty things and enjoy the creativity of our fellow Glitchian and to do that we are going to need a reliable lock down option. I hope that this gets fixed soon, so we can put out decorations without someone looking to take advantage of someone else's misfortune. 
    Posted 3 months ago by Enid Subscriber! | Permalink
  • A while back, with the help of several players, I did some systematic testing of how "drop" and "place" work in towers. I found that it didn't matter which verb was used.  Items a tower owner dropped or placed on furniture were locked to other players. Items dropped or placed on the floor were not locked. I find this counter-intuitive, and threads like this suggest it is counter-intuitive to others as well.

    In a game played by many thousands of people, anything that can be done most likely will be done at some point. Specifically, there will be some players who behave in ways that are immature, inconsiderate, and just plain mean. Knowing this, we can either adapt or cry.  It's difficult to adapt, though, when confronted with counter-intuitive design.

    I love Glitch, and I think the TS staff are marvelous both in their genius for design and in their responsiveness to players.  If enough players indicate that they are unhappy with the way "drop" vs. "place" works in towers, I'm betting there will be a change.
    Posted 3 months ago by Splendora Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Dude, that sucks man. I'm sure you have a replacement cauldron, but if you need one, I'll get you one. It makes me sick to my stomach that somebody would steal from somebody else for any damn reason. It's just beneath us all. Well, apparently it isn't tho. But if you need somethin' I'm glad to help.
    Posted 3 months ago by Osiris χ Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Gah, can we once admit that the person who went through the entire tower searching for one thing that wasn't nailed down was not thinking that Loupin left out a free cauldon, amid all the other locked down stuff.

    Of course, there are people out there who don't know or care whether something was left out intentionally or not.  We're all aware of this, aren't we?
    Posted 3 months ago by shhexy corin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • With the new "one click pick up" system, someone can accidentally pick up something without really realizing it. So, it may have not been intentional. Or, it could have been intentional, but I think there are more glitchens willing to replace your stolen cauldron than there are glitchens who would steal one from you. :)
    Posted 3 months ago by rach.the.emobear Subscriber! | Permalink
  • ((hugs)) Loupin. Sorry it happened. Enjoy your holiday :)
    Posted 3 months ago by Atlantis Subscriber! | Permalink
  • shhexy you have hit the proverbial nail right on the head - the issue for me was that the thief must have gone from floor to floor seeing if anything wasnt locked until they struck lucky on floor five where id made a mistake with the cauldron.  yup my mistake freely admit - however this was a purposeful and willing act of theft.  i am absolutely happy with this game, love it and actually im even happy with the objects interface to a point (i have a different opion to objects being locked than others may thats all)  HOWEVER please lets not dress this up as someone accidentally picking up an object whilst exploring - i aint that charitable in my view  and im not alone in that view.  Rachael is also correct there are far many more generous kind glitches then there are low life - im just having a mega strop and rant and once ive kicked my butler a bit ill be better.
    Posted 3 months ago by Loupin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • and thanks all for the offer of a replacement - already got one thanks but you are all a bit lovely xxx  
    Posted 3 months ago by Loupin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • It might not have even been a mistake on your part. There's been documented proof that some glitchen can pick up items "placed" when others cannot. It is a buggy system, and not to be trusted. I wish there would be a dev post about this so that more people were aware. "Place" does not always lock things for everyone.
    Posted 3 months ago by Aliera Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Awww Loupin, so sorry somebody grabbed a cauldron from your beautifully decorated room. I agree that it is unlikely the person imagined the cauldron was out there for someone to take.

    On the other hand, I agree with rachaelah that the person who took it might not have been a hunting-for-thievery-plotter. Don't pick-uppable items get highlighted when you walk past them?  It seems much more likely someone just saw the opportunity and could not resist making off with a high-value item that was unexpectedly grabbable.
    Posted 3 months ago by Lil Frumious Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I'm a little troubled by the assumption that whoever picked up the cauldron MUST have gone through the tower looking for something to take. It's just as possible that they only visited a single floor of Loupin's tower because the display there interested them (or they only visit the fifth floor in every tower, or they clicked the wrong number on the elevator, or even if they were working steadily through the floors they still would have only gone through half of them to find something on the fifth) and happened to hover over something that said pick up.

    And like others have said, there was no way for whoever this was to know that the cauldron was a permanent part of the display rather than something left out purposely to take. A souvenir from the tower experience, perhaps.

    I'm not arguing that whoever took the cauldron is right in what they did, but there is a lot of jumping to conclusions surrounding this and similar topics that makes me very uncomfortable.
    Posted 3 months ago by karibean Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Vent away! 
    I have had similar complaints and came to the conclusion that some people Will just be selfish and not give a damn.  No, doesn't make it better, but it does make it easier to deal with.

    (hugs)
    Posted 3 months ago by Li'll Missy Brenda Subscriber! | Permalink
  • If it helps, I've found that placing things on rugs seems to help avoid theft, as the item is still on a piece of furniture and not just on the floor.
    Posted 3 months ago by Djabriil Subscriber! | Permalink
  • There was no theft, since no rules were broken when they took the cauldron.
    Posted 3 months ago by Sturminator IX Subscriber! | Permalink
  • how much of a loss is a cauldron when you're a high level anyway? 
    Posted 3 months ago by shhexy corin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Ya I had some things taken off my rug.  However I'm not sure if you can lock things down on a rug can you? Can anyone confirm?
    Posted 3 months ago by Webbie Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Yup rug = floor. So can be taken.
    Posted 3 months ago by Atlantis Subscriber! | Permalink
  • In my tower and in a few others I've tested, things on the floor (and I believe that includes things on rugs) are NEVER locked down.  It doesn't matter whether they are placed in decorate mode, placed while not in decorate mode, or dropped.  Items on the floor can be picked up and taken.  If it can be done, then it probably will be done. I'm not talking right or wrong; I'm talking reality.
    Posted 3 months ago by Splendora Subscriber! | Permalink
  • That stinks!  so sorry.  I've seen some absolutely incredible towers (must have taken a lot of work and thought) and I really want to visit yours now.  I guess Glitch should have a big Beware! Here be Trolls sign -- unfortunately. :(
    Posted 3 months ago by MontytheGeek Subscriber! | Permalink
  • There was no theft, since no rules were broken when they took the cauldron.

    Agreed. However I think fixing the bug which sometimes makes things placed in decorate mode not locked should have a higher priority than it appears to have now. (Having this bug out there undermines faith in the system and discourages people from decorating their towers.)
    Posted 3 months ago by Janitch Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Such is our world.  Sad.  As far as being a "high level player"  I'm quite sure that had someone stolen one of Pacasso's works of art, he would have been quite hurt and felt the loss of something he had poured his soul into just as much as a child who's finger painting was lost. A violation of ones work has nothing to do with the wealth or level of the player.  Lock your doors ladies and gents or simply see it as it is, pixels and poor sports.
    Posted 3 months ago by Li'll Missy Brenda Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I agreee 100% with Loupin. Stuff in house/tower unless with price tag is not for sale. That said, +100 to a freebie basket where you CAN leave stuff for others. If I don't want the stuff I would either put it in auction, donate it, or leave it outside near my street sign.
    Posted 3 months ago by Holly Waterfall Subscriber! | Permalink
  • i came across this lovely alice in wonderland decoed floor once and accidently picked up some of their tickets on the floor...i was surprised and i did put the stuff back as it clearly was deco but got some img for "discovering" new things so was happy :D
    Posted 3 months ago by Meltemi Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Loupin - I am sorry this happened and that it made you feel bad. Your post has stirred up a bee in my bonnet, because I'm not convinced you forgot to put the cauldron down in decoration mode.

    For anyone who is interested, I've set up a test on Floor 2 of my tower.  There are five items that other players may or may not be able to pick up:

    - a ruby that was "placed" on the floor while in decoration mode
    - a shiny object that was placed on the table while in decoration mode, then dragged to the floor
    - an amber that was "placed" on the coffee table while in decoration mode
    - a stinky cheese that was "placed" on the coffee table, while *not* in decoration mode
    - a divine crepe that was dropped on the coffee table

    I'm betting that both of the items on the floor can be picked up, but that all the items on the coffee table are locked.

    I don't know if this is a bug or if it is the intended design.  Either way, I think it's a source of misunderstanding that should be addressed either by a design change or by player education.
    Posted 3 months ago by Splendora Subscriber! | Permalink
  • There is a spawning spot in hell where a cauldron spawns. If you don't know where it is, msg me. 
    Posted 3 months ago by Eye Wonder Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I know how you feel, though I personally have not had anything stolen...yet...my roomie has. She's devastated and just started playing so she's taking it pretty hard.
    I don't know why the game would allow other players to take something that is in a house or a tower.
    I remember a time in this game where that never would have happened. Where we all were respectful, honest, and helpful. I would give someone just about anything they needed if I had it to spare. It's not cool that people just steal things.
    Something really should be done about this.

    Does anyone know if just anyone can get into your house, or do they need keys?
    Posted 3 months ago by Stylegeist Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Well thank you all to those generous kind people who have mailed me cauldrons - much to restore my faith in glitch kind which was kinda high already.

    I think this thread has run its course as its treading over old ground - thank you for allowing me to rant and it felt therapeutic. I realised that all human life is here which makes its rich diversity so amazing.  All i would say is that just because i've invested time in playing this game to reach a reasonably high level does not rob me of basic rights of property ownership.  Theft has a variety of definitions here's one:-

    theft is the taking of another person's property without that person's permission or consent with the intent to deprive the rightful owner of it.

    I didn't give consent for anyone to take the item that by all definition I owned so if it looks like theft and it feels like theft.......

    So - to end all this - what do I want TS to do about this?  Nothing of course - its humanity working at its best and worse.
    Posted 3 months ago by Loupin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Stylegeist, I have to say that I do not remember a time in this game when things were not taken, purposefully or accidentally, when the original owner did not want them to be taken. When you might not have heard about it? Sure. But unless you're talking about early-mid alpha (I didn't join until the last few tests of alpha), this thing has always gone on. It's been with different people and different game mechanics and some of it has been talked about (hence a lot of the mechanics changes to the game) and some of it just shrugged off, but it's always been there. 

    I've loved this game since day 1, but I don't think false nostalgia helps anyone.
    Posted 3 months ago by karibean Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I didn't give consent for anyone to take the item 

    You did, by dropping it...

    (Unless you placed it, in which case TS need to fix that)
    Posted 3 months ago by shhexy corin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • One-click pickup is very awesome, but with that being an option I think it's more important than ever (and I thought it was pretty darn important to begin with) to fix any bugs about placing/dropping in towers, and then to communicate very clearly to players (possibly in new fashions for existing players vs. new players) what we can and cannot expect in our towers.

    I also think it would be fantastic to have some options as far as what is locked and what is shared.  I know the current setup is preventing people from sharing food and drinks in a nice cafe or restaurant style atmosphere (i.e. items on tables or counters that can be picked up by visitors).  (I think this could probably be done in a way that gives us those options without being overwhelming with options or confusing.)

    (Possibly, while I'm thinking about it (although I don't think this is an original idea?), it would be neat to be able to buy a street art permit, allowing your dropped items in streets around Ur to be locked for a period of time.) (Adjusting expense of permit and duration of item lockage could make this so that it wouldn't be obnoxious - and it would be neat to have a bit of time, even just ten real life minutes, to admire the art just made out of shiny valueless objects before they become taken away.)
    Posted 3 months ago by diaveborn ♥ Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Stylegeist: People must have a key to get into your house, OR they must knock while you are online and get explicit permission from you via a little pop up you get when they knock.
    Posted 3 months ago by Little Miss Giggles Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Dropping something is not consent.

    Love the gift basket idea. I could have as many as I want with stuff them. There needs to be a basket big enough to put furniture in for those of us who like to do the occasional big give!
    Posted 3 months ago by Supershero Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Dropping something is consent. You've dropped it, it can be picked up by anyone.  This is how the game works.
    Posted 3 months ago by shhexy corin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Atlantis & @Webbie - Hmm, dunno what to tell you then. I had quite a few things in my tower early on that were placed in deco mode on rugs... nothing went missing (even though a few things I mistakenly dropped in the same room were). Maybe I just got lucky.
    Posted 3 months ago by Djabriil Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I had an experience where people stole art where the few individual pieces of sparkly that made up the art were almost not worth in currants the time it took to pick them up. If it wasn't obvious that it was art, I was standing there asking people not to pick it up and telling them if they did want sparkly I'd give them their own sparkly, to no avail.  Was I frustrated? Absolutely.  Did I consent to their taking it?  Well, I'd asked them verbally not to take it, but the fact of the matter is that they *could* take it, and I knew they could take it, and as far as "consent" goes that overrides (in game terms, but not in polite human nature let's not be jerks terms) anything I may have asked.
    Posted 3 months ago by diaveborn ♥ Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I just want to let everyone know that there are some Selfish and Malicious people in here!  Yes, I'm steaming at this moment and should wait to post, but I won't! There were a great deal of cauldrons donated to the tower, Each one was stolen.  All of them!  This was Deliberate and just plain Mean.   Tell me I am a fool to expect anything different, but I don't care!  I DO expect more of people, to have some morel fiber!  

    Venting!

    sorry if I have offended anyone
    Posted 3 months ago by Li'll Missy Brenda Subscriber! | Permalink
  • i will drop and "place" some things in my house. knock and try to get them.
    Posted 3 months ago by Sad Pollen Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I don't get why people never steal stuff from my street. I actually like it when people steal my stuff. Moar thieves at my place. Less thieves other places.
    Posted 3 months ago by Moehr Ossum Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Anyone *can* walk up to the front of my house and steal my 6 year old daughter's bicycle, too. We don't have a way to lock it up here as none was provided by our landlord and we can't modify the property. That doesn't mean they should, and the fact that no one has to date* indicates to me that the vast majority of people know that they shouldn't take things at other people's homes, even when it's possible to do so.  If someone did take it, we would never have a way to know who it was, so fear of being caught isn't a factor.  There are no cameras or security of any kind outside.

    I'm not trying to declare what people should feel about whether or not something is theft.  There are people in the world who would fault me if her bike was stolen by someone, saying that I should not have left it unlocked outdoors.  (Even without considering the impossibility of locking it, I don't believe anyone is to blame when they're the victim of a crime.  Criminals are.) I'm just pointing out that there are very clear parallels possible here that most people would agree are theft, and to just say "It's possible so it's not wrong" is, if nothing else, dismissive and may prevent people from determining what the community's expectations are as a whole.

    * If you include her tricycle in the count, that's about 3 years.
    Posted 3 months ago by Magic Monkey Subscriber! | Permalink
  • News flash:  Some folks aren't as nice as other folks.
    Also: Anything you drop is potentially gone. So, quit it.

    Yes, the idea that others are not nice chaps my hide.
    But that's the same reason I lock my stuff down.
    Posted 3 months ago by CrashTestPilot Subscriber! | Permalink
  • ...It's a cauldron. Replace it, but do it right this time. Did we really need this announcement? Yes, people are mean. Everywhere. ::shrugs:: I'm not sure what the problem is, here.
    Posted 3 months ago by Lady Cailia Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Magic monkey-
    #1: Just because someone can take something that doesn't belong to them doesn't make it right.
    #2: If someone owns something and it is of value to them, they will find a way to secure it.
    #3: Just because someone thinks they have secured an item doesn't mean it can't be taken.
    #4: Usually a note helps but is not a guarantee.  
    Posted 3 months ago by Holly Waterfall Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Yes, there is right and wrong.
    There is also what's permitted by game mechanics.
    In this case, something unfortunate happened that the devs have been working hard on.
    Doesn't mean the cauldron picker wasn't a jerk.
    Doesn't mean that the person who placed the cauldron wasn't careless.

    It sucks, so let's drown the OP in cauldrons and move on.
    Posted 3 months ago by CrashTestPilot Subscriber! | Permalink
  • My sentiments were primarily addressed to people who were saying that it wasn't wrong because it was possible to do or that because there are no Official Rules against it that nothing happened and/or it's wrong to be upset.  To be completely forthcoming, I'm not even sure at the moment where my opinions land on the issue in-game.  I can determine what I think for some specific examples, but overall I find the issue too murky to have made a definite personal call.  However, saying things that indicate that someone shouldn't be upset about something irks me.  So I wanted to provide an example where the statements were clearly not applicable to give people another perspective on the issue.  I've made somewhat similar statements myself in the past (in that case, it was leaving something on the ground in Cebarkul and walking away from it).  Since then, however, I've come to appreciate that there's still a difference between what's possible (snagging anything not nailed down) and what's polite (saying, "Hey, did you mean to leave this?" before shoving it in your pockets).

    Holly, #1 was rather my point.  #2 is what I was somewhat arguing against.  There's not always a way to secure things, and thus, leaving them somewhere doesn't inherently mean the person doesn't value it.  To go back to my example, I can guarantee you my daughter values her bike, more so than most of her possessions.  So she owns it, and it is of value to her.  We still can't secure it, as we can't change how our townhouse works (we can't add a bike rack that's secured to something) and there's no room for it inside the house.  Technically, we could put it in the middle of the kitchen floor, but that is at best completely impractical if we'd like to use the kitchen for cooking and dining, or even walking through to get in and out of the house ourselves since it's also the room with the front door in it.  So it's not a reasonable option, even if it's a physically possible one.  She probably could also put it in her bed and sleep on the floor or in the bathtub, too, but those are also unreasonable technicalities.  
    Posted 3 months ago by Magic Monkey Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Magic Monkey, where would you have her keep the bike if you knew it was legal to take it by anyone who walked by? Immoral perhaps, but legal nonetheless.
    Posted 3 months ago by Sturminator IX Subscriber! | Permalink
  • MM-Sorry I was trying to play the logical card vs. the practical card. What I was trying to point out in #2 is exactly what you posted recently. Technically, you could drag it into the house before you retire for the evening. Leaving it in the middle of the living room/kitchen or where ever, should not be "in the way" because you are sleeping. Unless of course it would be a large obstacle to move in case of a fire or something. So yes, I get that it's impractical to drag it inside. It therefore is simply a case of value then. I understand it is important to your daughter not to lose her bike. If it is similarly important to you then you will figure out a way to protect it. What would you do if it got stolen? 
    In Glitch, things are a bit different because they are technically imaginary things. They may still have value to you though, i.e. of course you don't WANT someone to take your extremely rare Yeti doll. If that is the case, then you find a way to stick it in an SDB or keep in it inventory where no one else has access to it. But if you make a mistaken click and drop it and someone picks it up then you will need to just forget about it or acquire a new one. Glitch (like life) is not fair sometimes.
    Posted 3 months ago by Holly Waterfall Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Even if Loupin had "locked" the cauldron in decoration mode, it still might have been removable by another player, because THERE ARE LOTS OF BUGS.  I say this loudly because even if you have a friend try to pick things up, and the friend can't budge them, it is entirely possible that the next player to come along WILL be able to pick them up.  Also, I've been able to pick up items from furniture but not from floors, which is exactly the opposite of what's supposed to be true.

    So please, please don't leave things of value around unless you want others to take them.
    Posted 3 months ago by glum pudding Subscriber! | Permalink