Topic

Help from a dev needed: Favour spoints accidentally spent.

At this point when I was considering if I'm going to get a paid subscription after the trial ends, something quite unfortunate happens to me.

Farming for my first Humbaba emblem, knowing I'm very close and trying not to donate too much, I click on "Check Favor". I had 907 points out of 1000. I just pressed Enter, assuming it'd work as an OK button and just close that window. Instead it spent all those favor points on learning a skill faster, something that was certainly not my priority at the moment (if I was hurried with learning I wouldn't have selected a skill that takes about a whole day to be learned).

The Live Help channel wasn't of much help. A player, not a Tiny Speck employee, was there to tell me nothing could be done, that he spoke to "a dev" (that didn't want to give their name, hiding behind the player instead) that said "that's how the game works" and that they are working on an "are you sure feature" (despite that this has been happening to other people for a long time, this simple feature is not ready yet).

I work on the IT business and used to own a private gaming server. I know how simple it is, with the resources Tiny Speck has, for someone to verify a transaction and undo it. All I am asking is that the learning time is increased again, and the favor points given back to me so I can donate that last item and get my Humbaba emblem to enable me to learn Animal Kinship 6.

Thank you.

Posted 15 months ago by Macadamia Ellicott Subscriber! | Permalink

Replies

  • I have a spare Humbaba emblem you can have, I'll mail it to you.
    Posted 15 months ago by Twodee Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Isn't Glitch great? Yay Twodee
    Posted 15 months ago by Kookaburra Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Twodee wins!
    Posted 15 months ago by shipwreck Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I think most of us have, at some point, done the same thing. 
    I don't think it's a matter of anyone hiding behind someone else. The live help channel has some wonderful people helping out and really, do you expect staff to drop everything over something like this? 
    It's not urgent, it's not life changing, it just sucks.  
    If they're working on an "are you sure feature", then they're aware of the problem.
    Sorry it happened to you, but you really can't expect it undone for you personally when most people who've played for a while have had it happen to them and just learned from their mistake and carried on. 
    Posted 15 months ago by Ebil Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Your tone absolutely smacks of entitlement. Glitch is already an easy game, and I'm sorry that you accidentally spent some favor points. It's really not that hard to gain them, as I'm sure you'll find. In fact, there will likely be times when you get Emblems out of nowhere and what you really wanted was favor points to spend. 

    Bottom line: Don't sweat the small stuff. Glitch isn't about winning or losing or fixing your "mistakes" but rather, Glitch is a game where there are no mistakes and we're all just here trying to have fun in our own way!
    Posted 15 months ago by Jhennauchan Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I've gotta say, it is rather easy to hit that button by mistake. I now have all the medallions twice over, but when i stopped myself from getting the first one by mistake to get 40 minutes off learning...I was quite beside myself :P
    Posted 15 months ago by xLIFEx Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Hi Macadamia Ellicott, I know you must be frustrated because it can take a while to collect that much favor, but that really is how the game works.  Lots of us wish we could reverse some shrine action or another (though most lean towards wanting to give back an emblem and spend the favor on speed learning)!  The great thing is, everything is replaceable in Glitch, so you can always collect up more stuff to donate.  And as you saw above, there is often someone willing to help out if you "screw up".
    Posted 15 months ago by larky lion Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Thank you for the offering, Twodee. I appreciate your intention, but I don't feel a fellow player should compensate for something that happened because of a design flaw.

    And for those that feel requesting a reversal is out of place... the beta is over, there are no more resets... and these people work here... as in they do get paid to do it, and are even hiring people dedicated to customer support, to handling tickets, they don't have to "drop everything else", it's not like they are volunteers letting us play here because they are nice, the funding this company has is immense, and there are a lot of people paying subscriptions. I could have been one of those people, but after this, and without a single reply from a staff member even to tell me to go screw myself... it's highly unlikely that I will renew my subscription once it expires.
    Posted 14 months ago by Macadamia Ellicott Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Glitch is awesomely unique in that player interaction is very much a part of the core game mechanic. A culture of compassion and a desire to construct a community consisting of mutual respect and fun keeps things amazing around here.

    Macadamia Ellicott, we're all part of the game. Perceived design flaws aside, Twodee's kindness is every bit as much valid as if a dev edited some database table for you. I'd even argue that it's better this way: it might take a few keystrokes to "correct" this on the back end, but it takes a genuine desire to contribute to a great community by sending you the result of someone else's hard work. That means a lot more.

    I don't want to play the game where something unpleasant happens and we wait for people with special access to fix it; I want to play the game where we help each other out and have fun along the way. I'm glad this game works that way.
    Posted 14 months ago by The Dalai Lama Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Mistakes happen.  But do you really expect to be given preferential treatment?  If they reverse your "accidental" favor point use, they'd have to reverse everyone else who "accidentally" used their favor.  Have you lost anything of real world value?  I'd venture to say no.  So just find more items to donate and then grab the emblem, or accept the generous Glitch's offer to give you one.  Coming onto the forum to whine and threaten not to subscribe will not only not resolve your issue, but cast you in a pretty negative light right from the start.
    Posted 14 months ago by Joojoo Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Twodee said she has two. Once you spend one, any extra ones can only be used for the caress, consider, etc. Once you get to a certain point, people even start leaving emblems on the street for others to pick up because they cannot be auctioned. This is a good way to share the wealth.
    Posted 14 months ago by anonymoose Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I already sent the emblem when I made my first comment. I should have checked with you first Macadamia but I'd still like you to have it. I don't see it as compensating for something that tiny speck have yet to perfect. It was simply that I hoped it would help cheer you up after your frustration, one player to another. I'll understand and won't be offended if you prefer not to on principal, feel free to pass it on to a new player if you like. You may yet get an official answer, they are very busy since launch it seems.
    Posted 14 months ago by Twodee Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Macadamia Ellicott: The problem with reversing the mistake is that it opens the possibility for a player to spend >997 favor points to fulfill the Under the Wire quest, get the points back, and then get back on their way to earning an emblem.
    Posted 14 months ago by Honoo Flammen Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Well, the real problem is that if we got into the habit of undo-ing everything a player didn't mean to do (or later regretted or changed their mind about) we would not do anything else, for there are far more players than employees: it's just not feasible. Maybe it would take a few minutes in this case, but a few minutes times 25,000 or 100,000 or 1,000,000 is many, many person-years of work.

    Macadamia Ellicott: read what the other players have said … if that doesn't sound good to you, then I don't know what would: it sounds awesome to me :)
    Posted 14 months ago by stoot barfield Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Once again, +100 to Stoot.....I personally like that I can hit enter to do it- one persons "design flaw" is something that another person likes.....
    Posted 14 months ago by NutMeg Botwin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Part of the fun of this game is learning from mistakes.
    Please enjoy that fun.
    Posted 14 months ago by Diamondus Subscriber! | Permalink
  • As others have mentioned, we've all done this at some point. I did it during the first trial that i played. And unless it's super urgent, or game-threatening, it'd be a slippery slope and everyone would be posting undo requests in the forums.

    BTW stoot, OSM reply.
    Posted 14 months ago by Court Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Oh, and in regards to 

    "The Live Help channel wasn't of much help. A player, not a Tiny Speck employee, was there to tell me nothing could be done, that he spoke to "a dev" (that didn't want to give their name, hiding behind the player instead) that said "that's how the game works" and that they are working on an "are you sure feature" (despite that this has been happening to other people for a long time, this simple feature is not ready yet)."


    Some of us have been chosen and asked by Tiny Speck to be a part of the helping community....so it's not anyone hiding behind anyone- we love helping and being a part of the game. 
    Posted 14 months ago by NutMeg Botwin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I love knowing this game has players like Twodee in it to step up and try to make another player smile when they hit a frustrating point. Kudos, Twodee! :)
    Posted 14 months ago by Little Miss Giggles Subscriber! | Permalink
  • How many games do you know where the CEO (or whatever stoot's RW title is) of the game company regularly interacts with the ordinary players???  As I read through the forums, time after time I come across stoot's thoughtful replies to us little guys playing his game.  Absolutely awesome, stoot!
    Posted 14 months ago by Hawkwell Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Twodee, you made me cry. Twice... Yeah, I'm very emotional this week.... I hadn't logged in for almost three days, and didn't notice your letter when I went back in. It makes me feel kind of bad or guilty that you go so out of your way to make me feel better (I am good at giving, but I do have a very hard time receiving when there's nothing in return...). I am now debating if I should take it or not...

    Stoot, I haven't counted, but it doesn't look like there are so many players. Besides, Blizzard, to mention just one other company in the MMO business, does fix those things for their several millions of players. I went into the live help channel the very moment it happened, with the shrine window still open. My screen remained the same all the time, at least until I slowly ran out of energy and got sent to hell. Twoodee's gesture IS awesome. Unfortunately I can't say the same about yours.

    Nutmeg, this isn't against you, but I really don't like it when for profit organizations abuse people's good will by getting them to work for free, while they could be paying someone to do that same work. You, and the others that volunteer, have no responsibility over what Tiny Speck does, so yes, it was someone with the power to do something, sending someone that could do nothing to deliver the bad news.

    Hawkwell, I wouldn't be surprised if only a portion of the posts from his account (if any at all) were actually posted by him. Most company executives and celebrities have PR people run their social media accounts.
    Posted 14 months ago by Macadamia Ellicott Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Make no mistake, those posts are genuine stoot.  Compare them to some of his earliest Flickr posts 6 or 7 years ago. 
    Posted 14 months ago by WindBorn Subscriber! | Permalink
  • wow.  Not much else to say.  But M.E. - that is definitely Stoot.  The staff is TS is very small - the executives do not each have someone running around with a broom behind them.  Volunteerism, even in dreaming-for-profit site, is far from unheard of.  In fact it is the rule for member support.  This game is offered free after all.  wow.
    Posted 14 months ago by Kookaburra Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I have been working with Stewart for more than a decade now. He has never once had anything posted in his name that he did not himself write. For one thing, no one would ever be able to write to his standard :)
    Posted 14 months ago by eric Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "the executives do not each have someone running around with a broom behind them" - i wish!
    Posted 14 months ago by Bees! Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Only the ones riding unicorns, Bees.
    They're the only ones that really need it. 
    Posted 14 months ago by annapeee Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Mmmm, entitlement.... Guise, fix this cause I was just thinkin about not renewing if you don't. Here's the problem: " I just pressed Enter, assuming it'd work as "

    Also, stoot and bees! are awesome. And I don't even usually like bees. :)
    Posted 14 months ago by TrentSkunk Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Mmmm, TrentSkunk.... I wasn't thinking about not renewing if they don't fix this. I was giving the game a try and evaluating if it was worth purchasing a membership or not when this happened. This type of support (or lack of) does certainly not make me want to pay. I hope you understand the difference and the reasoning behind it.

    The game is available free, sure, but they need subscribers to keep it running and return the investment. Specially at this stage, every player should be treated as a potential subscriber. This treatment is not worth $ 14.99 a month.
    Posted 14 months ago by Macadamia Ellicott Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Macadamia Ellicott, here's what I don't understand: hitting the ENTER key does not work to spend favor points. You have to actually click on the button. What am I missing?
    Posted 14 months ago by eric Subscriber! | Permalink
  • OMG, devs: you guys are hilarious! It must be really fun to work for Tiny Speck. 

    Macadamia, I understand your frustration. I've been utterly frustrated at multiple fumbles on my part that made me do the exact opposite of what I was intending to do in game because of the lack of an "are you sure" button. At the same time, I would be really annoyed if I kept having to hit "are you sure" before doing anything. The game is awesome enough in general that I can be irritated at first, then shrug it off, then continue having fun. I hope you can reach that point as well. Please keep giving the game a chance for free (at least), and maybe later down the road you will have a better idea of whether or not the subscription is right for you. I predict that the utter awesomeness of most things in the game will end up outweighing the few irritating things :). And yes, favor will be easier to obtain as you increase in level and unlock more aspects of gameplay that automatically give you favor points (like working on projects).
    Posted 14 months ago by Shepherdmoon Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Apparently, Macadamia doesn't realize that Tiny Speck is but a handful of very passionate dudes working hard to bring their little creation to the masses, not some massive Corporation like Activision Blizzard with the resources and manpower to churn out video games monthly.  Good thing for me that Mac lost all credibility when he/she threatened to not subscribe if he/she didn't get his way (kind of reminds me of King Curtis) or I might have taken his comparison to Blizzard seriously.

    And a big LOL @ Tiny Speck being a "for-profit organizaton".  How many years has Glitch been in development guys?  Yeah, I'm pretty sure stoot & co. are swimming in hundred dollar bills.  :p
    Posted 14 months ago by Joojoo Subscriber! | Permalink
  • One day in the near future this whole thread will seem totally blown out of proportion.    Sure, at levels less than 15 or so losing 997 points at a shrine seems like a big deal, but in the grand scheme of things, it's nothing more than a batterfly flapping it's wings in Level 2 West.

    Blizzard spending time undoing players regrets?  Don't make me laugh.
    Posted 14 months ago by Vicereine Linnæa Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Joojoo, don't forget the dudettes.
    Posted 14 months ago by WindBorn Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I'm really flabbergasted that the whole basis of your subscription is over 1000 favor points....
    Posted 14 months ago by Zu Subscriber! | Permalink
  • omigosh....  I have made so many "mistakes" in this game!!    But they've been *my* mistakes.  All part of the learning process.   I had a new player give me his/her Emotional Bear a while back, when I *knew* they were just trying to hug or kiss me.   So I gave the Bear back and explained how to use it.   Just part of the game.

    You made a mistake.   But it's a mistake that you could learn from and move forward with.
    Posted 14 months ago by Pirate Apples Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @eric: Has that been changed? I was using only the keyboard, not the mouse (I'm from the age when first person shooters were played with the arrow keys to move, and Ctrl, Alt and Shift to shoot, strafe and run). That's how it worked this morning when I wittingly spent 997 favor points I got with another giant to do the Under the Wire quest.
    Posted 14 months ago by Macadamia Ellicott Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "At the same time, I would be really annoyed if I kept having to hit "are you sure" before doing anything."

    Oh lawdy, as a longtime Windows user....well, you know.  Revenge of Clippy.
    Posted 14 months ago by Nanookie Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Wowza.

    Personally, I'm usually rather glad when people who display such a charming mix of entitlement and unfounded suspicion threaten to leave.
    Posted 14 months ago by Helcat Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Even worse than wasting a lot of the developers' precious time, I think undoing accidents that players regret doing would undermine the (virtual) reality of the game. Glitch is not one of those "Time Travel Understander" games! ;) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fABGyVzVwI
    Posted 14 months ago by Bernard Snodskuel Subscriber! | Permalink
  • LMAO at that video. Seriously, go play Braid for a while - you'll end up being GLAD that Glitch has no time travel function. Believe me.

    (I loved that game, played it between Glitch tests for a while, but oy it is a whole different way of thinking, one that I suspect would turn my brain into oatmeal after sustained exposure.)
    Posted 14 months ago by Tally Subscriber! | Permalink
  • As to the donation/hitting return... I don't think that has changed. At least not for a good long long time. (I can't remember if things were different months and months ago.) It is pretty hard to do it by mistake.

    Not that I haven't done TONS of things by mistake. (I must stop carrying tree poison when speed harvesting. Sorry, random trees.)

    I think one lesson that comes to mind has something to do with flies and honey and vinegar... but why anyone would want flies is beyond me.
    Posted 14 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Macadamia Ellicott: "Has that been changed?"

    No, it has not been changed. I'm going to a add a confirmation step when you click the button, in any case.
    Posted 14 months ago by eric Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Lord Bacon-o: I tried the honey in the live help channel, it got me nowhere.
    Posted 14 months ago by Macadamia Ellicott Subscriber! | Permalink
  • It didn't get you nowhere; it just didn't get you the answer you wanted. No amount of honey, vinegar, chocolate cake, foie gras, etc etc was going to.

    It's a game. Living and learning from experience is part of the fun. I wouldn't want to play a game with an undo button, personally. You might, and that's okay, but it's a desire that's not going to be satisfied by Glitch.
    Posted 14 months ago by Tally Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Macadamia, haven't you thought about how Humbaba would feel if the developers rolled back all his favor points that you accidentally spent? Who's going to explain to Humbaba that you don't really appreciate his favor, and want a refund? Isn't challenging the gods and their laws the definition of hubris? Pissing off the developers and the user community is one thing, but are you really sure you want Humbaba pissed off at you? According to Wikipedia, Humbaba is NOT somebody you want to mess with! -- In Akkadian mythology Humbaba (Assyrian spelling) or Huwawa (Sumerian spelling), also Humbaba the Terrible was a monstrous giant of immemorial age raised by Utu, the Sun.[1] Humbaba was the guardian of the Cedar Forest, where the gods lived, by the will of the god Enlil, who “assigned [Humbaba] as a terror to human beings.” He is the brother of Pazuzu and Enki and son of Hanbi.
    Posted 14 months ago by Bernard Snodskuel Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Just released: you can now use the ENTER key to spend favor point from the Shrine dialog window... and if you use the ENTER key or click the button, you will now get a confirmation dialog before you actually spend any points.

    So, I made it easier and harder, in one go!
    Posted 14 months ago by eric Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Bernard wins the internets.  Or at least, the wikis.
    Posted 14 months ago by Pallas Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Ha! 
    Eric is so dedicated, so determined to fix this offending process.
    But, but, this process doesn't actually exist for him to fix!! [one might say] 
    No problem, eric first enables this wicked, tricksy, favor stealing process, and then he fixes it!
    Love it :)
    Posted 14 months ago by La_La Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Eric, awesomesauce... as always.
    Posted 14 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink
  • The confirmation dialog made my nipples explode with delight.  Expect a hospital bill in the mail.
    Posted 14 months ago by Biff Beefbat Subscriber! | Permalink
  • If your mouse pointer is in an inopportune place when you hit enter, then an inopportune button can be activated; I suspect this is what happened to the OP.
    Posted 14 months ago by Fnibbit Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Biff: BWAH!!

    @Fnibbit: I thought of that too, tried it, didn't happen to me. Maybe it depends on computer/browser settings?
    Posted 14 months ago by La_La Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Fnibbit, I can see how you might think that, because the menus for interacting with items work that way (hit the ENTER key while a button is highlighted and it submits that button), but that is not the way the Shrine dialog worked. The only way to spend points was to click the button.
    Posted 14 months ago by eric Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I make silly mistakes like this ALL the time.

    But I wouldn´t quit an awesome game like Glitch or refuse to pay the subscription fee over such a little thing. I can see the love and care that has gone into this game just from playing it. And it´s not a corporate run deal like WOW. It´s a pretty small staff dealing with a huge influx of players and issues since Beta ended. Sometimes it may take awhile to get to every issue.

    And if something happens like this in the future. . . don´t feel shy about asking for some player support. The Glitch community is amazing! I would have definitely made some stuff for you to donate to get back those favors points. I´ve been helped numerous times. It would make me so happy to help someone else out and pay that kindness forward!
    Posted 14 months ago by le beebs Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I've only skimmed this thread, but I must say that Glitch has by far the BEST support base of almost any game I've ever played... scratch that, of ANYTHING I've done on the interwebs. What we have here is a unique combination of very deeply involved and responsive """""corporate""""" (note the number of quotes there) folks with a large supply of personally invested (not necessarily financially invested) generous players in a community that absolutely FOSTERS helpfulness and support. If you come here expecting some monolithic corporation running the scene and making uninformed edicts from on high or every-man-for-himself obnoxious spammy players, you'll be sorely disappointed. I think that's a good thing.
    Posted 14 months ago by Jenllip Subscriber! | Permalink