Topic

Some Icons give way more iMG than others... any ideas?

Even after I tithe, some are giving me less than 200 iMG and some well over 400.  Also, some other posts mention getting way more iMG than this, any ideas why mine are so low?  I have 8 of the icons,  if that makes a difference... thanks in advance for any insight into this quandary!

Posted 7 months ago by Clarabelle Subscriber! | Permalink

Replies

  • 1) IMG is linked to mood as always, even with Icons, so always have 91%+ mood when using icons.

    2) The IMG and tithe of Icons is linked to your level. Higher level, higher tithe, higher reward.

    3) Each icon has 4 usages between tithes.... it has been apocryphally observed that the first dose is higher then it declines, but it is somewhat random. It may be that all 4 doses are just completely random.

    And work on getting those last 3 icons soon! You can swap emblems to make em in the market too.
    Posted 7 months ago by LokiPDX Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Hmmm.  Forgot to mention that I'm always at high mood when I reflect on my icons.  I'm still curious why I would be getting such radically different amounts of iMG, when my mood is the same for all of them and my level is the same for all of them!  Maybe the tithing explains it, I'll have to experiment with tithing to all of them at the same time to see what happens.

    Thanks, Loki, for your input!

    EDIT -- just realized that level would explain why other players are getting higher iMG than I am, so that's a good mystery solved :-) 
    Posted 7 months ago by Clarabelle Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I have not paid close attention and have always assumed that the IMG earned from reflecting on any given icon had a random variation - sometimes more, sometimes less on the same icon. Just curious, have you kept track to verify that some icons always give more than others? This would definitely be worth knowing, if true.
    Posted 7 months ago by Hawkwell Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I'm not very organized at keeping track of my actions here, but I feel like some icons have consistently given less.  I wonder if it's tied to how much I have donated in total to that particular Giant?  *sigh* Guess I'm going to have to keep better track...
    Posted 7 months ago by Clarabelle Subscriber! | Permalink
  • This is an interesting question. I'm going to start keeping a record. Watch this space!
    Posted 7 months ago by Hawkwell Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I've (no analytics to back this up) "felt" that the Icons bestow more {iMG/energy/mood} to you if you perform actions they prefer. Mine a lot since your last reflect with Zille? there's a spike in iMG for you from Zille for all that mining you did. Do a lot of engineering construction/tinkering? Alph's been watching and has a bonus for you on you next Icon interaction with Alph, and so on and so forth.

    I could be completely off my rocker, but there "feels" like there's a link between the things you do in game and what the Giants offer when you interact with their Icons. 
    Posted 7 months ago by CleverCharacterName Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I think the icons have changed rather dramatically. I am level 43 and reflect at winky mood and I also get a range of iMG from the 100s to the 1100s. They often demand a tithe after only one or two usages - definitely not four, sometimes three. Although I occasionally get a very high payout following a tithe, I'm more likely to get 300 - 500. Overall, I definitely agree with Clarabelle:

    They are greedy little buggers, demanding more and giving less.
    Posted 7 months ago by Audaria Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Nothing apocryphal about the first dose being bigger.  The first dose after a tithe averages 50% more than each other use.  I have hundreds of data points to prove it.

    I most wrote about icons in terms of energy gains in the past because I was level 60 and didn't get xp, but I've done enough tests to convince myself that mood and imagination give the same results (okay, to almost convince myself).  You can see the details here: 

    Here is how it works:

    Price of a Tithe is 121 + 33 * (Your level - 20)  {It's 121 from 10 to 20 and before 10 you aren't allowed to tithe}

    Number of uses per tithe: Between 2 and 5, averaging 4

    Value of an activation: Random averaging 50% of tithe value, but 50% larger if it is the first use after a tithe

    Imagination returns are affected by mood, so with 91% or higher mood you will get 20% more imagination than you would energy or mood
    Posted 7 months ago by Humbabella Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Have you verified these numbers since the change to imagination? I am certain that I'm seeing lower payouts and more frequent tithing requirements. My average number of uses is more like 2.5 than 4.
    Posted 7 months ago by Audaria Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I'll start collecting data again, using half of my icons for energy and half for imagination to see if there are any differences.
    Posted 7 months ago by Humbabella Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I'm definitely getting significantly less IMG than I did XP - function of the "lower level" that we all became?   (My tithe is lower than it was, certainly.)  I don't use them for anything else.
    Posted 7 months ago by oscarette Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Odd, I have a low-level alt who tithes for me. She is level 8 (was recently level 7). Have they changed the tithe-allowable level in the last week?
    Posted 7 months ago by foolbunny Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I always have to tithe after 3 uses.  Once I reflect, revere and ruminate (in that order so I get the biggest hit on the reflect) I have to tithe again for the next game day. I don't recall ever having had to tithe for over or below the 3.

    Edit:  It makes sense that it's 3, so then you get one of each reward before you have to tithe again.  I'm wondering if the players here who are saying every 4/5 maybe have other folk tithing and using their icons also?
    Posted 7 months ago by ~Arabesque~ Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Having a low level alt tithe for you is using an alt for an unfair advantage in the game. Therefore I'm going to complain loudly about it and change the entire tone of this thread because i am upset by everything that other players do that I don't do myself. 
    Posted 7 months ago by Papa Legba Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Not really Papa, I think it'd be fine provided the alt has made and is using their own money.  It's really not much of an unfair advantage either.  If you want to pay less to tithe then just find a lower level player to tithe for you and pay them the cash.  It's really the same difference.

    Edit: Alternatively you can just leave all of your icons outside of your home so that folk passing by can tithe them too - believe it or not, some street roamers do that! I quite often tithe icons are see on fellow glithchens home streets.
    Posted 7 months ago by ~Arabesque~ Subscriber! | Permalink
  • LOL @Papa Legba!

    G-mail was practically made for cheating!

    Also, I've been meaning to make some sort of comment about idolizing your TH-reference-based name for some time :)
    Posted 7 months ago by foolbunny Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Regarding having low-level characters tithe for you, I've noticed that I get significantly more IMG after I tithe an icon myself than if a low-level character does it for me.
    Posted 7 months ago by Yeti Spaghetti Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I only have about 30 data points so far from post-change icons and imagination but they are almost exactly what I expected: 90% of my tithe value for the first Reflect action (50%, plus a 50% boost for being the first one, plus a 20% boost for high mood) and 60% of my tithe value for the rest (50% plus a 20% boost for high mood).

    @Ocscarette: Yes being lower level means it's less than it used to be.  Each level you lost was 33 off your tithe value which means about 22.3 less img per Reflect (averaged over them all) than before.  That doesn't sound like much but if you lost 15 levels then it would be over 300 and you'd really notice.
    Posted 6 months ago by Humbabella Subscriber! | Permalink
  • FWIW, it still seems a bit random to me.

    The other night I was getting 700s & 800s — first action after tithes, full mood — but last night, under the same conditions, I got between 250 and 400. In fact, I even leveled up in the middle of those points.

    Since reading this thread, I've been tithing every time whether it needed it or not, and always Reflecting immediately afterward.

    Edit: does it matter whether mood is 91% winky vs. 100% winky?
    Posted 6 months ago by dm Subscriber! | Permalink
  • dm: It is definitely *very* random.  I only write about averages and even then I needed to average hundreds of uses before I could say anything confidently.  Also, 91% and 100% give exactly the same amount.
    Posted 6 months ago by Humbabella Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I never tithe but sometimes still get Giant Love . . .
    Posted 6 months ago by Leites Subscriber! | Permalink
  • The giants have been cheaping out.

    I tithe right before I reflect to get the good payouts (which seems to work).
    What I have noticed is that lately there are times where I can tithe, then reflect and then the icons are complaining about needing to tithe again. This usually occurs with 8 - 10 of them at a time.
    Posted 6 months ago by Yog-Sothoth Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I'm not sure that tithing when the icon still has uses left actually fills it up, I think instead it just gives you favor.  I'm going to do some testing on that.
    Posted 6 months ago by Humbabella Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Yeah, tithing when the icon is not asking for it doesn't "reset" it. The Giant just takes that as an extra tithe, a special proof of your devotion. The only tithes that will reset the icon are the ones you give when the icons are whining for them.
    Posted 6 months ago by Sirentist Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Hmm, I just assumed that the value of imagination increased with time. So that the icons I made first (and have therefore had the longest) gave more imagination than the new ones. However, I have not tested this and have no clue in what order I actually made them.
    Posted 6 months ago by Phaedra Jane Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I am pretty new to icons. and i have no hard data -just some general fairly casual observations: I too wonder abou tthe variety in img given to me. I do have a big variety in the img that is bestowed when i activate the icon. I've never hit an 1100 kinda number , i think my img given is usually from 225 to 800 or 900 . i usually reflect all mine right after new day if i am in game- or as soon as i log in when ive been out of game awhile. so i am at full mood when i reflect.
    I was wondering if it is tied to the ongoing over-all donations at the SHRINE of the giant .or if it is only tied to the overall total currant tithes to the particular icon .. i would love to see more info from you lovely number crunchers or a clarification from TS . ;)
    Posted 6 months ago by serenitycat Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Serenitycat: The value returned from an icon is tied to your tithe value which is tied to your level.  Trust me, I would have noticed if it had anything to do with shrine donations!

    I had hundreds of data points pre-imagination change to verify my findings and I'm working on generating hundreds more to make sure nothing has changes.  So far everything is working exactly as I described it above.
    Posted 6 months ago by Humbabella Subscriber! | Permalink
  • serenitycat - I've been thinking the same thing. No hard data (math is for the real word, I refuse to do it in a GAME) but I think it is tied to the favor at the corresponding Giant. When I have recently collected an emblem - i.e., my favor is then low - the iMG received from reflecting at that shrine seems to be much lower, on average. (I'm talking in the 100 - 200s.) When my favor is higher, that seems to be when I get the 1000s and even up into the 1300s.
    Posted 6 months ago by Audaria Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Humbabella, I admire your fabulous dedication to logic and science in Glitch.

    This is kind of off-topic, but: I'm super curious what determines the amount one receives in an instance of Giant Love, especially in regards to favor or iMG.  Has anyone noticed any pattern to these?

    Someone mentioned that, even untithed, the icons still dole these out on occasion, but is the tithe status reflected in the amount of iMG or favor?  Or is it still based on level?  Or is it based on something else entirely, like current favor or standing with the particular giant?  (I swear, all my icons usually give something in the 400s in Giant Love iMG, but my Lem icon consistently gives me something in the 600s.  I mean, I've been learning teleportation skills for the past few weeks... maybe Lem just likes me more...)
    Posted 6 months ago by Classical Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I'm having the same thoughts...my iMG points differ radically and doesn't seem to make a difference if I prompty go to the ones who are giving lower iMG...it doesn't raise it nor does it make a difference if they are just ready to spit an emblem out to me.  I'm confused and if anyone has some suggestions, they'd be greatly appreciated.  I've also focused on what the Giants like....still confused it didn't seem to make a difference.  Like you guys I've left them alone and not asked for mood or energy boosts and then I've turned the tables and asked.  No diff.  Thoughts?  (And yes my mood is always always 100 percent when I go near them)  They do seem to be giving more iMG bonus'...that's a good thing...when I walk by em. (Edited to add:  I'm mid Level 45, half way to 46)
    Posted 6 months ago by AlmostSilver Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I just tithed to one giant and got a measly 493 img on immediate reflect; tithed to another and got 1177.  (I only use icons for giant love and reflects, and only tithe on demand.)  When I leave my house I'll see what my favor levels are with those two ladies.   ETA: and a third, 407 img.   Reflects from icons not demanding cash: 334 to 726.

    EDIT Now that I"ve been out in the world: Okay, I'd just picked up emblems with all three of those harpies, and had zero to 145 favor with them; no reason for two of them to be so dam' low.  The one who gave 493 is I believe the giant I have the second-most favor with.  So why so mean with the handouts?!
    Posted 6 months ago by oscarette Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I also don't seem to get any 'use' out of icons before they need tithing again.

    I don't do anything except 'Reflect' on them yet they still need tithing regularly!  I thought they were supposed to give two or three actions/uses before they needed currants again?
    Posted 6 months ago by Cassandria Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Other than Humbaba I consistently have exactly the same favor with all giants but the icons still give extremely variable returns.  Even with over 30,000 current favor you don't notice any increase in value.

    I know some people don't like doing math or statistics, but it's important to realize your brain is this awesome pattern matching machine that will definitely find patterns where there aren't any unless you actually record data and analyze it objectively.  I completely respect anyone who doesn't want to do this to figure out rather trivial aspects of a game they play, but I hope you give some weight to the result of people who actually do this stuff.  That's what great about an online community, there is almost always someone crazier than you who will do the tedious stuff for you.

    Icons will give 2-5 uses before needing a tithe.  If you are getting lower than this, can I ask if your icons are on your lawn?  If so other people might be eating up your uses, if not I don't have any other speculations.

    I tried to record giant love at some point.  I'm sure it's based on your level, but it also seems very random and, of course, it's much hard to collect data on.  They will still do it if they need a tithe, but I have no idea if they'll do it less.
    Posted 6 months ago by Humbabella Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I do respect your math Humbabella. I've just done way too much for work, so I do not choose to do it for fun. I'm looking forward to seeing your post-change results. My icons are in my house, so I can say with certainty that no one else is eating up my uses. While I refuse to keep a written log, I have been making mental notes, and I am still pretty darn sure that I'm now getting less than I did before the change.
    Posted 6 months ago by Audaria Subscriber! | Permalink
  • We're investigating a bug which (it appears) makes it so that the first use after a tithe given when the icon was "empty" sets it back to empty again. I have definitely noticed this.

    But, the amount you get is based on the same (large) random range for each giant.
    Posted 6 months ago by stoot barfield Subscriber! | Permalink
  • thanks for the update Stoot : )
    Posted 6 months ago by ~Arabesque~ Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Thanks Stoot. It is cool you checked into the weird hunches of the users:)
    Posted 6 months ago by Yog-Sothoth Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I knew my little buggers were greedier! Glad to hear it's being investigated.
    Posted 6 months ago by Audaria Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Thanks Stoot, I am keeping a check on them now, perhaps they will behave now they know you are on their case!
    Posted 6 months ago by Cassandria Subscriber! | Permalink