Topic

piggy underpopulation problem

what happened to all the piggies? Is everyone hog-tying them off the streets for their own gardens? Can't we leave some for everyone to enjoy? I hatched a new pig in Pakodi Prim today and within an hour it was gone, bringing all of Andra down to 7 piggies. Do we need a piggy replenishment society?

Posted 14 months ago by Niqster Subscriber! | Permalink

Replies

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  • Just a note, there are about five? Piggies around the Tool Vendor in Cebarkul, Uralia. At first I thought someone was populating, then realized they were probably dumped when the person couldn't sell them. They have no access to trees, so I snagged one and am letting it free elsewhere, hopefully other people can help to get them somewhere where they have things to nibble too?
    Posted 14 months ago by Sunburst Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Not particularly happy with the fix, but I suppose it will have to do.

    I've also noticed someone placing a bunch of piggies around Tonga Trips blocks, thank you! I've been leaving grain for them to eat.

    @Lucille Ball - Are you sure about them still dying on grain? I've had these 4 piggies eating nothing but dropped grain (about 800 on the floor now), been alive for about 5 days
    Posted 14 months ago by Bluigi Subscriber! | Permalink
  • After reading this thread I'm feeling a bit awful about 'relocating' a couple of piggies in the Bortola area into my house as part of doing the quest >.> Please be assured fellow Glitchen that they are well cared for and happy and I faithfully promise to help with creating more piggies once I've learned the skills to do so.
    Posted 14 months ago by Jezzle Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Now we have seven pages of auctions of hog-tied piggies.  I don't suppose we could discourage that too, Blanky?
    Posted 14 months ago by Lucille Ball Subscriber! | Permalink
  • A potential solution has been suggested in this thread:
    www.glitch.com/forum/ideas/...

    Bring the cost of pig bait in line with the value of hogtied piggies and maybe you'd see less thievery.  So long as there's an incentive, this will continue to be an issue.  Unless, of course, you add a visual for when someone's carrying a hogtied piggy and you give us the ability to 'tackle' the individual and free the piggy.  Wouldn't that be fun!  Pain train is coming!  Woo woo!
    Posted 14 months ago by Joojoo Subscriber! | Permalink
  • A single person is auctioning 72 of the 125 hog-tied piggies in the auction house right now... if that's not abusing the system I don't know what is. I think they should make it so only piggy eggs and piglets can be auctioned, thus bringing down profit margins to a more fair level.
    Posted 14 months ago by Andobas Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Pigs can escape and run off, so why can't they escape and run out of the auction house!? that would surely disuade people if they randomly lost their deposits and didn't get piggies back either
    Posted 14 months ago by Balgra Fonzarelli Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Seem reasonable, Andobas.  Hogtied piggies are better suited for a black market, not a legitimate market.  I mean, they have duct tape on their mouths for God's sake!
    Posted 14 months ago by Joojoo Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Pigs can escape and run off, so why can't they escape and run out of the auction house!? that would surely disuade people if they randomly lost their deposits and didn't get piggies back either

    Ha!  I love that idea :)
    Posted 14 months ago by shhexy corin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I think that auctioning hogtied piggies, without the outlet of vendor sales and donation, will prove a fairly fruitless endeavor.  People wanting to repopulate public streets know  that buying the hogtied ones is counterproductive, and will buy eggs or piglets, or season their own.  Many people wanting piggies for their homes will do the same, or hogtie public pigs themselves, and the remaining demand for private pigs is pretty limited.

    Looking at those hogtied piggy auctions, most of them are not going to sell, and the auctioneers will have to deal with re-listing those piggies or releasing them.
    Posted 14 months ago by Fnibbit Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Hahahaaaaa... Jail Break !!   72 Auction house piggies make a run for it.  
    Posted 14 months ago by Ooola Subscriber! | Permalink
  • As I mentioned on a different thread, I think this change was an over-nerfing.  Less money from the vendor, and less favor from the gods would have been preferable to not being able to do it at all.  Piggy hatchers deserve to be able to sell or donate their extras without the wrath of the community assuming they're rampant piggynappers or thieves.  Some people released their extras, some people sold theirs, some did both (like me) -- now, no one has a choice, and anyone who auctions a hog-tied piggy is going to be called out unfairly, which disheartens me.

    It honestly makes me not want to get involved in anything piggy related at all.  I don't support being given less choices.
    Posted 14 months ago by Gant Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Who said you have no choice?  You are free to negotiate the sale of your extra piggies to individuals or do something for the community and release them in underpopulated streets.  You don't have to sell in the auction.
    Posted 14 months ago by Joojoo Subscriber! | Permalink
  • + 100 gant!!!
    Posted 14 months ago by Pixieyelsraek Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I think it would have been interesting to see what might have happened if people had not taken it onto themselves to hatch more public pigs.   I'm not saying I would want that situation permanently, but I would wonder what the effect of Piggie Armageddon might have had on the Glitchen economy. 
    Posted 14 months ago by WalruZ Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I like this change. Let someone sell piggies on the auction if they want. More will try, driving prices down and making piggynapping less profitable. On top of that, you still have piglets and pig eggs on the auction. We should all encourage purchasing piglets and pig eggs as well as making one's own.

    As for that hogtie quest...I always just released the piggies ASAP after hogtying. :)
    Posted 14 months ago by VorpalCheese Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Changing the game so that hogtied piggies can no longer be donated or sold to NPC vendors was done to prevent game exploit by those willing to treat other players as a means rather than an end.  Like most changes, this no doubt will inconvenience some players who were not engaged in exploits -- but that is the nature of change.

    I'm also glad to see that auctioning is still allowed, since this seems significantly different from being able to sell or donate to NPCs. In order to gain currants from auctions, someone capturing pigs on a large scale needs to have other players as buyers. I don't think that everyone who sells a hogtied pig will be assumed to be a thief, since most of us understand pig farming.  However, players who auction hogtied pigs on a mass scale might find buyers a bit wary -- and that might be a good thing for reputable pig farmers. 
    Posted 14 months ago by Splendora Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Gant: I don't think reducing the value would do anything to solve the problem.  As long as piggies sell for more than pig bait costs people would be selling them for profit.

    The problem isn't malicious trolls, it's just that if a behaviour is profitable then people will do it.  Having played lots of video games, I initially assumed that piggies would just respawn on their own.  So I vendored piggies to buy my house when I started playing.  I don't know how I could have known that it was a bad thing to do at the time, especially since I usually try to avoid reading about the game so I can discover things on my own.  I like this change because I'm sure the game is filled with people like me.

    But also @Splendora: I don't think you should describe selling piggies as an "exploit."  It was how the game worked, and how it was built to work.  People did it because it was part of the game.  The consequences of that were not great for the community and so they changed it.  We don't need to vilify people who did it.
    Posted 14 months ago by Humbabella Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Why not let the price be modified by the number of a given item sold to a vendor over the last (rolling, not reset each day) 24 hours or similar time frame.  This lowers the return on selling piggy’s in direct proportion to the number of pigs being sold.  The more people sell, the less profitable it becomes.  If the price dropped by, say, 10% per piggy sold in the last 24 hours and bottomed out at say 35, You end up with a fluctuating piggy value based on player behavior.  The more piggy’s people sell the less they are worth,  and subsequently, the fewer additional piggy’s people will bother to pignap.
    Posted 14 months ago by Syruss Subscriber! | Permalink
  • The current solution (auction only) does the same thing you're suggesting.
    Posted 14 months ago by WindBorn Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Sthenno - In using the term "exploit," I did not mean to vilify.  To me, this is a technical term that refers to using features that are part of a game to produce results not forseen and not desired by the game developers.

    Those who were capturing and selling/donating piggies with the assumption that they would automatically respawn, clearly had no bad intent. However, if the result of this activity was to reduce the pig population below what the developers intended and below what was required to provide adequate food resources for low-level players, then I would categorize it as an "exploit" -- with no intention to vilify.

    Unfortunately, once a game "exploit" has been discovered, it may attract those who do have a less innocent purpose, such as engaging in mass pig capture while being quite aware that pigs generally don't respawn, and that maintaining the pig population requires some players to donate a resource for the good of the community. This is why TS tends to make changes when a game "exploit" is discovered, even if those who have been using it intended no harm.
    Posted 14 months ago by Splendora Subscriber! | Permalink
  • The current solution devalues pigs. Without a means of exchanging pigs for either favor or currants the value of pigs will plummet as the demand from players drops as most homeowners will only ever acquire enough pigs for their yard and public streets are overrun with swarms of swine.  Eventually almost no one will care to buy pigs at auction at all.  They become little more than self ambulatory trees.  You can hatch them, raise them, and harvest them,  but that’s about it.  Besides, the current solution also has people screaming “NERF!”.  So why not consider solutions that address excessive pig poaching without drastically changing the pigs part of the game and game economy?
    Posted 14 months ago by Syruss Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "They become little more than self ambulatory trees."  -- you say that like it's a bad thing. 
    Posted 14 months ago by WalruZ Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I don't think piggies were meant to be a commodity in the first place.  They're as close to pets as we've gotten in Glitch so far (at least to some of us) and they're a source of a commodity (meat), but I don't think the devs intended them to be stolen off public streets and then sold for a profit ad nauseam. 

    The outcries that this change was a 'nerf' lack merit.  It was an exploit (using Splendora's definition) that allowed those with unscrupulous intentions to benefit financially from the work of others.  With the exception of a few piggies populated by GOD at the beginning of time, most piggies you saw on the streets were created by other players, incurring a cost of ingredients, time, and energy.  For a small cost of 25c, they were being poached and either sold (for a hefty profit) or donated to shrines, thereby removing them from the game world, which affected even more players since now they were no longer able to nibble them for meat.

    I don't see how this change has a negative affect on pig farmers (unless you're hiding your true intentions).  You can still sell your excess piggies, just not to a vendor.  Or better yet, why not do something nice for the community and release those excess piggies in less populated streets?
    Posted 14 months ago by Joojoo Subscriber! | Permalink
  • When I started this thread, it was because I had the hogtie quest and got frustrated that I couldn't find a single pig near my home to hogtie. I don't have a problem with people using the hogtie quest to add pigs to their yard, or whatever. I had a problem with not having enough public pigs for a few reasons: 1) I needed them for the hogtie quest 2) Even though I have pigs in my yard that I hatched myself, I like petting and nibbling on my travels.
    This nerf solves the problems I had, that even if I tried to repopulate the streets in Andra the pigs I released were gone very quickly. I don't think there's a need to feel bad if you hogtied a pig or five for your yard. I don't think there's a need to feel bad if your understanding of the game mechanics meant you donated hundreds. However, since the nerf, it's a lot easier to find public pigs, and I'm happy with that.
    Also, I do not take a high number of pigs on auction as evidence of people profiting. High availability is likely an indication of low demand, the market will take care of itself. Too bad about the people who had a good hustle going and got stuck with a bunch of piggies, good thing it's just a game.
    Posted 14 months ago by Niqster Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Do pigs die of things besides starvation?
    If not, what happens when all the pigs are depressed and can't be interacted with anymore due to overpopulation? There comes a point when everybody has enough in their houses and there are enough on the streets, when they only get added but hardly removed. That would result in trouble for the quest doing newbies, too, wouldn't it.
    Posted 14 months ago by SpringkinkZebra Subscriber! | Permalink
  • All of the animals are unhappy when they are overcrowded.  If nothing else happens, they are transported by the Giants to a better place.
    Posted 14 months ago by WindBorn Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "Or better yet, why not do something nice for the community and release those excess piggies in less populated streets?"  

    That's just the problem.  The streets won't BE less populated.  When the only option becomes releasing pigs onto the streets (selling at auction won't work because there will be so many pigs on the streets that there would be no need for anyone to buy one from the auctions) the streets will all become overpopulated with pigs.  
    Posted 14 months ago by Syruss Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I've read that chickens, sad from overpopulation, fly off to other streets.  I would expect piggies to do the same.  But I cannot confirm that.
    Posted 14 months ago by Joojoo Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I've started overpopulating streets with pigs in response to this. I wasn't a piggy napper, but I still don't like the knee jerk reaction that came out of it.
    Posted 14 months ago by Jhennauchan Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "All of the animals are unhappy when they are overcrowded.  If nothing else happens, they are transported by the Giants to a better place."

    Do the giants also rescue starving piggies?

    I still feel sad when I see starving or clearly abandoned to be starved piggies, but that's just an automatic reaction of mine upon seeing any imagery of sad animals.  I really care a lot less about what happened to other people's piggies than I care about the piggies I raised.  I played WoW - had to hunt way too many cute cuddly animals.

    Basically, what annoyed me was that people were taking advantage my good will, not that "not real at all virtual" pigs were being abused.  I think most of the supposedly bleading-hearts players are like so.

    So if you think that starving/abusing virtual piggies would upset a lot of people - then like others, I feel must chime in also - I really don't care or can even care about what YOU do with YOUR piggies.
    Posted 14 months ago by Pming Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Observations tonight:
    a) Auction plate for HTPs is down to 5 pages, from 7.
    b) Prices are being suppressed.
    c) I didn't feel like buying.

    Let's look at what tomorrow brings.

    !CTP!
    Posted 14 months ago by CrashTestPilot Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Syruss: Disagree.
    @Joojoo: Agree
    @Jhennauchan: +1
    !CTP!
    Posted 14 months ago by CrashTestPilot Subscriber! | Permalink
  • this is what is nuts, i'm all for people selling a couple but when someone farms this much to sell on AH for more currency than they could spend in game it gets a bit silly...

    www.glitch.com/auctions/PHF...

    17 pages of auctions... smells like a gold farmer to me
    Posted 14 months ago by Balgra Fonzarelli Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Oh, him or her.  XD

    He's always been like that - the first time I encountered one of his listings - I think it was for a knife and board for something like 599 or 699 currants.  Knife and Board is just 75c at the kitchen tool vendor.

    Back then, I was low at currants so I tried reselling as well, but I just marked up by about 100c.  They did sell very fast, so yeah - probably a few newbie players have bought knife and boards at 599c.

    The really funny thing about HS though is that at one time - he actually bought up all my 175c auctions and I think of others as well.  So, I could only assume that he was trying to make sure newbie players could only see his 599 listings OR he was using an auction automation script that malfunctioned somehow.

    Btw, I am not accusing HS of using an automated script.  It's just one of only two theories I could think of for why he bought my marked-up-by 100c kitchen tool auctions.
    Posted 14 months ago by Pming Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "17 pages of auctions... smells like a gold farmer to me"
    I doubt it's anything sinister; there are a bunch of folks using this tool it seems.
    Posted 14 months ago by juv3nal Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Question - that tool is legal?
    Posted 14 months ago by Pming Subscriber! | Permalink
  • ooohhf didn't know about that program!

    no wonder people are able to post 30 auctions within a min - i had no idea how they were doing that!
    Posted 14 months ago by Balgra Fonzarelli Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "that tool is legal?"

    I imagine so.  There's a tool that allows you to buy auctions items automatically (people refer to this as the sniper).  it looks for things at a certain price and buys them automatically.  Stoot said a while ago that this was fine (people don't like it because it snaps up bargains in seconds). 

    Here's a comment from him in a recent thread

    "I could keep going with that list for another page or so, but the point is that switching from an ask-only auction to a bid/ask auction is barely even treating a symptom of the underlying issues (and there is already at least one API-based tool for automating purchases based on bids you make: in the long run, we expect most serious users of the auction system to use third-party tools because it will mostly be high-volume trade of basic commodities, not small batches for immediate individual use)."
    Posted 14 months ago by shhexy corin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • XD.  In that case, time to try to profit from the auction system (again).
    Posted 14 months ago by Pming Subscriber! | Permalink
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