Topic

Is it the dreaded G word?

(I put this here in Off Topic because it not specifically about Glitch)

The word griefing gets tossed around a lot and the line may be a thin one. I know it well. Anyone who has played most FPS online knows that horrible moment when you enter a game and someone just kills you over and over, living for just second, because they've modded (or whatever). That is obvious (using cheating to break the physical rules of the game to not just win but to do it to piss people off). Straight up causing grief.

But if they are not breaking the physical rules? Where it is a subjective question as to breaking the spiritual rules?

Today I came upon a question that answers it for me, and it actually ignore the question of intent of the player.

If this was an actual game event, performed by an NPC, could I come up with a story/game reason for it? And a follow up question: Does the action actually break the game or just make things more challenging?

Let's take a very simple example: Killing spice trees in Ur. What if it was being cause by NPCs? What if it was a cult that for whatever reason hates spice? (Maybe they believe spice is evil because food should be bland because spicy food is decadent.) And for me it works. The game play (if I care enough, which I don't) would be save the spice trees! Must keep them alive against these zealots!

How about butterflies in mining areas? Again, the ecology has gone a bit wonky. Perhaps Zille, bored by the drab colors of batterflies, has imagined butterflies in her cavern. Or Cosma has developed a crush on Zille and, because she's a bit ditzy, gave her a bunch of butterflies.

I think these questions answer it very well for me. Now I don't care at all what the "greiefer" is thinking... which also, handily, takes away what the they want - attention. I get cool story elements that are surprising and they get zilch.

Thank you for listening.

Posted 13 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink

Replies

  • I normally have zero tolerance for threads discussing griefing, et al in glitch, because they tend to turn into a bitch fest. But this?

    This is awesome. Really well written and compelling idea. It adds a nice layer of fun to in-game scenarios. 
    Posted 13 months ago by Xev Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Eh hem...
    Zille is a female giant, as she obviously has vast tracts of lands, haven't you seen her emblem?
    ~Fyxen, First Primate of Zille, The Hendarchy
    Posted 13 months ago by Fyxen Subscriber! | Permalink
  • anyone who aggressively plays this game in any fashion is a try hard. he's doing it wrong. know that and move on when facing a try hard. best just report that person and come back when he's offline. of note, it entirely depends on the staffer who is on based on what will happen. i've had polar opposite reactions from staff for the same exact situations. don't expect consistency in staffer response. 
    Posted 13 months ago by Mr. Dawgg Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Xev, I agree (about avoiding these discussions). Definitely why I put in in Off Topic. It was just a curious revelation I had while talking to other players: If it COULD be part of the game, why not make it so in my head?

    Fyxen, you are 100% correct. As someone who considers his self a minor scholar in the lore of the Giants, I am ashamed by my mistake. I am correcting now.

    Mr Dwagg, these things are always going to be subjective. But my thought is to not look at it as "Ack! They are ruining my game right now! My only two choices are to tell them they are being jerks and start a chat flame war OR to walk away and come back later when they are gone. Such a bummer." It is to ask "What if this were an in game, programmed event? How does that effect me? If I don't think about whether I'm angry or mad at the PLAYER but think about how it makes me feel about the world, how to I play than?"

    If it WEREN'T an online game, if I were playing Super Mario, and game across something new and different, I wouldn't go on Nintendo's forums and tell everyone Bowser is a jerk.*

    *Actually, I would. I hate that Bowser guy. What a jerk.
    Posted 13 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Our storytelling/choice of media tells us about our values.

    That is, we watch legal dramas to see justice done, medical dramas to see people receive help, police dramas to see criminals caught and held accountable, and so on. So it actually says something if we prefer shows where you mess with people's heads and try and vote them out/off the show.

    That being said, my usual question is - given a fantasy/creative world, why would you choose to be a jerk? Wouldn't you prefer to be something you aren't?

    Additionally, from having done improv as part of working on my acting chops, if TS sets the scene, it's not really improv to deny or bring a negative influence into the scene. TS provides a tree; I can harvest the tree, pet the tree, water the tree, invite friends for a picnic under the tree - these are all strong, creative choices. But 'rar, poison tree, cut 'em all down' would be considered a poor choice, because it denies others a resource/creative play.

    The game was pitched as helping imagine the world, make it bigger. Picturing cults of tree-poisoning zealots, IMHO, doesn't fit that concept.
    Posted 13 months ago by TK-855 Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Lord Bacon-o: Don't stop at my first sentence, read the second! I love this idea. It adds a hell of a lot of depth to the game. 

    @TK-855: There are countless threads debating the merits and perils of changing the game world in ANY WAY WHATSOEVER. This is not that kind of thread.
    Posted 13 months ago by Xev Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Xev: Where did I say 'can't change it ever'? Please don't put words in my mouth.

    I'm just not of a mind to excuse griefers as some kind of creative play. I did not, if you'll note, say there should be some kind of draconian patrol or tightening of rules until there's no fun or play at all. It's about making strong creative choices and evangelizing that.
    Posted 13 months ago by TK-855 Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I'm merely pointing out that this isn't intended to be a serious thread, but an off-topic "hey, here's this nice thing that I do instead of getting irritated."

    I completely get that you aren't down with that and don't want to excuse what you see as antisocial behavior. I'm in NO way saying that's not a legitimate stance, or that you aren't totally justified in that perspective.

    What I am saying is that those opinions have a place and a purpose in those serious on-topic threads. I really like this thread because it isn't super serious, and at the risk of speaking for the OP, I think that was his goal with it as well.

    TL;DR: It's cool to be mad about stuff that makes you mad - but no one here is mad. This thread is chill pace.
    Posted 13 months ago by Xev Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Xev: I did see that! I should have added a smiley or something. :)

    Oof. Improv. I am, in a bit, come back and address it. I've been meaning to write "Concept of Yes/And and Glitch" post for awhile... might as well go here. Hopefully later tonight. And, yes, I am going to pull my "As someone who as been doing improv not just as workshops but as an art form for the last 5 plus years card...." I apologize in advance.
    Posted 13 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink
  • idk. if an NPC is doing something damning to the game, i would imagine people would complain. i know firsthand how people constantly complained about the water dungeon in ocarina of time. i can't tell you how many houses i had to go to in order to get my friends unstuck there.
    Posted 13 months ago by Mr. Dawgg Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Lord Bacon-o: Maybe put it in its own topic, so we can get all serious and artsy. ;D

    Xev: Cool beans. Just imagine I'm a drug dealer from another planet who is secretly sucking dry the brains of Glitchen to make an addictive drug ....
    Posted 13 months ago by TK-855 Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @TK-855 Is that some sort of commentary about the zombies in this game? That's pretty insensitive. I'll have you know I'm friends witha zombie.

    p.s. purely out of curiosity, is your user name also your model number? Are you a ... robot?
    Posted 13 months ago by Xev Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Xev: ".... drug dealer from another planet who is secretly sucking dry the brains of Glitchen to make an addictive drug ..." is a reference to "I Come In Peace," starring Dolph Lundgren and Brian Benben.

    And the TK is the prefix for 501st Legion members with Imperial Stormtrooper armor, inspired by the line, "TK-421, why aren't you at your post?" Each costume has its own 'detachment' or specialized group, such as the Clone Troopers (CT), etc.
    Posted 13 months ago by TK-855 Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Fantastic. That's vasty more impressive and amusing than my guess.
    Posted 13 months ago by Xev Subscriber! | Permalink
  • you guys and your star trek
    Posted 13 months ago by Mr. Dawgg Subscriber! | Permalink
  • You're joking, right? That's a joke?
    Posted 13 months ago by Xev Subscriber! | Permalink