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### Topic

#### Healthy / unhealthy… who is to decide?

ok this is a rant, so if you are not up to it, just leave again.
It's my first time ever posting something here. And thats just because today, i got soooo angry and sad, that I was shaking. And I am not easily offended or made upset. I am usually pretty easy going.
Before I get to the heart of it, this first.
Before the img homes, I lived in Tamila. the only place I have ever lived. Tamila is where my heart is, and always will be.
Long time before the new houses, two friends of mine and me started to populate Tamila, with piggies, chicken and butterflies. First because it was convenient. We just had to step out, run a circle in Tamila and had enough meat to donate.
We always tried to keep up the population. Piggies die, get taken or what not. That's alright. Every week we took the time to fill Tamila up again with about 10 piggies per road.
After the change to the img homes, I , like lots of other glitchens, had other things on my to do list. So I didn't really check the population that much. One ore two times I filled it up again. And every time I could see more glitchens come up to the north to nibble their heart out.
So day before yesterday, I thought to myself: hey fill up Tamila again. 10 to 11 piggies for every street that has trees. And since I do the nibbling tour at least 2 times per RL day, I make sure to water, pet and harvest trees too, so they wouldn't starve.
So this afternoon I made my first tour. And this evening I wanted to make my second tour. BUT… most streets were stripped to about 3-5 piggies. I found one glitchen that was taking piggies with youth potion. And asked why they are doing it.
The answer was:
"Oh we are trying to THIN OUT Tamila and surrounding areas - waaaay too may piggies = Overcrowding - How about instead of 11, keep the numbers below 10? eh? Not enought ppl passing by to water and harvest the trees for them to feed on - on a reg basis, that is" "We are not trying to *clear the area of piggies*...merely trying to keep it at a healthy number, probably 5-7 on one street. "
To make myself clear. There was no street where the piggies where sad and no street without trees that I put piggies on. I am passing by on a regular basis to water and pet trees. I wonder what made them think that they had to clear the region of overcrowding?
I can hear all the complaints already: If you want to nibble piggies go to the HR routes. Well, to be honest, i don't really enjoy it so much to hop form one home street to the other, the whole day. I much more enjoy it to hop through Ur. I don't like to nibble one big pile of pink something. It scares me. I like to nibble piggies that are roaming Ur. I could go to other regions, you might say. But I just like to be in Tamila, it feels like home to me.
So my question is, who are you to decide what is healthy and what is not? Who called the self declared piggie police to decide how another glitchen has to play the game?
rant over…..

Posted 6 months ago by Ancale | Permalink

### Replies

- Populate a line of streets regardless of region..?
  Posted 6 months ago by LųĉĩđεşşΨ | Permalink
- ' Who called the self declared piggie police to decide how another glitchen has to play the game? '
  Careful how you use this argument, it goes both ways.
  Posted 6 months ago by Kochanski | Permalink
- Perhaps now that the folks who worry about pigs starving on unattended streets know that the pigs in Tamila are cared for daily they won't feel the need to rescue them! I certainly hope that no ones thinks Ancale is telling anyone how to play, just letting the rescue squads know that the Tamila pigs are allllllright!
  Posted 6 months ago by Sloppy Ketchup | Permalink
- I regularly pick up exploded piggy parts when going through underused regions - but once the game is public again this won't be a problem. Don't worry! The pigs are being taken care of one way or another! They're fake pigs that don't remember or love you in any way. It will be alright :)
  Posted 6 months ago by La Mariposa | Permalink
- As you know, everyone has their way of playing. You put out piggies, they like to pick them up. If they didn't pick them up, you couldn't put them out. So, it's a mutual piggie appreciation in a way. My question is, what are they doing with the piggies?
  I have adopted Quarter piggie orphans that were rescued but that rescue operation was not appreciated either. Some people liked caring for their pigs in the old quarters and I have two friends who each enjoyed their pig farms at their old homes. I liked visiting them too. I have never pignapped anyone's pigs.
  You could leave notes but there are some who like to pick up the litter and keep the streets clean so notes don't last long. So, the best advice I can give is just keep putting the piggies out and let them keep picking them up then you will all be happy. As for the pigs, I have no idea how they feel but they do love to be petted so I do that a lot.
  Posted 6 months ago by Brib Annie | Permalink
- Something I would wonder is... where is this glitchen taking the piggies? To a lesser crowded area to benefit everyone or to the auctions to benefit only them?
  Ancale is doing this to provide meat to all glitches and to keep up on the areas she puts them, not just for herself.
  Just a question to ponder.
  Posted 6 months ago by Littletoe Wundrheel | Permalink
- The traffic in wild areas was once far greater than it is now, since the housing change. As a result, I often find piggies living on islands with trees who have gone unfed for days (as evidenced by their inability to produce meat)
  So...the overcrowding issue may be one of traffic. most streets used to have enormous amounts of foot traffic to keep them happy with pets and tree harvesting for food. Now, not so much.
  I don't thin the herds when I encounter them, but I suppose I could see some who think to do so to minimize problems resultant from the low traffic situation. On the other hand, it could just be an excuse for piggy harvest of another kind. In case anyone forgets, there are some who keep huge herds of pigs and butterflies with no regard to their virtual happiness, just the quickest way to some meat and milk, and they don't blink when it comes to overcrowding, they just replace them when they die..
  (I keep four piggies at home, 7 butterflies in the back yard and 9 in the front, with four chickens for each. they produce sufficient quantities for my needs.)
  Posted 6 months ago by Woochi | Permalink
- *hugs* to Ancale : (
  Posted 6 months ago by ~Arabesque~ | Permalink
- fascinating...
  Posted 6 months ago by WalruZ | Permalink
- The pig rescue group relocates all piggies that are rescued. Piggies are taken from an over crowded street where the trees couldn't sustain all of them, and places them on streets that can still sustain more piggies. It's just a balancing act. Ancale says they like to run around Ur for the piggies instead of on home streets, well, the piggies are still in Ur.
  Posted 6 months ago by Octavious Orion | Permalink
- Seems to me both parties had good intentions, no need to imply otherwise.
  Can the new note posts be used in public areas? A couple notes on poles that wouldn't be "cleaned up" could alert visitors that the pigs were being taken care of daily.
  You have my sympathy Ancale. Sometimes when we're at a low point, energy-wise or other, some incident that we'd usually shrug off, can hit really hard. Chomp on a carob bar, sip some hootch, & go right back to tending piggies. ^,^
  Posted 6 months ago by Phoebe Springback | Permalink
- I'm sure no offense was intended, Ancale. Members of P.I.G., the Porcine Intervention Group, relocate the animals we remove from overcrowded areas.Also, before the residential streets and quarters disappeared, we gathered all the piggies and as many of the butterflies and chickens as we could -- no small feat, considering the number and the fact that we often had to buy TP scripts to get to where they were. We found many piles of meat and plops in some areas because we couldn't get to them in time.
  Most of my home piggies are rescues. (I have 10, four in back and six in front, all free to roam, not held to one spot by a pig stick.) Obviously, I can't keep all of them, so when I wander Ur, I carry a bag of youthenized animals (butterflies and chickens too) to relocate to less crowded areas where there are trees. (So do other P.I.G. members.) I do not auction them. Rescuing is a part of game play, and we mean no harm or insult to any player by our deeds. However, when I come across seven piggies on a street with no trees, as I did earlier today, or piggies stuck up in trees they cannot feed on, as has happened many, many times, most recently over the weekend, you'd better believe I'm going to relocate them.
  OK, I'm done. Fire away.
  Posted 6 months ago by Mollie | Permalink
- But, just think of all the extra imagination you get for making piggy eggs to repopulate.
  Posted 6 months ago by Maddie_Rocca | Permalink
- some people just like to make rules for others to play by.
  they missed out on having a shiny hall monitor armband in elementary school and have regretted it ever since.
  Posted 6 months ago by flask | Permalink
- " But, just think of all the extra imagination you get for making piggy eggs to repopulate."
  But also the time, resources to gather and energy it takes to make them and then the time for the chickens it takes to incubate them.
  Posted 6 months ago by Littletoe Wundrheel | Permalink
- You think 10 piggies per street is great. Someone thinks 5 piggies per street is great.
  You are the self declared piggie police they are the self declared piggie police.
  Pig wars!
  Actually, I ran into the P.I.G. in the model home taking pigs I had deliberately put there. I do understand your frustration, you do something only to have someone right behind you undoing...blah
  Posted 6 months ago by M<3tra, obviously | Permalink
- You could name them: looked after by *yourname* it won't atop people if they want to be a pain but it may make them think twice.
  Posted 6 months ago by jiva | Permalink
- Littletoe Wundrheel: Maybe it's how I have my upgrades, but I get a bunch of imagination from gathering resources too. And from focused meditation to bring my energy back up. And while I'm hatching piggies, I tend to pet/water the trees on the street, which is also more imagination and the fruit and bubble trees double as extra resource gathering for the piggy eggs.
  Posted 6 months ago by Maddie_Rocca | Permalink
- I have been using Tamila's pigs for a while and I loved that it often had 10-11 pigs per street and NEVER were they starved or overcrowded.
  Posted 6 months ago by Rosencrantz | Permalink
- Many people have different ideas about where which animals and trees should be in Ur, and we all have the ability to push toward our own visions -- and the person who placed the animal or tree has no greater right to it than the one who removes it. (The devs try to provide a balance of incentives and costs so that we're not overrun or deprived.)
  My own vision differs from both the OP's and P.I.G's. I think tree pigs and pigs in other out-of-the-way places are utterly charming, and that it is better to feed them where they are than to move them, but that large numbers of animals on a street are hard to cope with. I'm not going to embark on some massive animal relocation binge in service of that, but when I do place or move animals, it'll be in a way that makes Ur just that little bit more to my liking.
  Posted 6 months ago by Fnibbit | Permalink
- So you're the lovely glitch that put all those nibblers in Tamila. I always wondered as I did my rounds who kept it so nice and populated. Just want to say thanks for that, I've collected hundreds of thousands of meats from your pigs and I appreciate your hard work.
  ETA: Also, I'd be happy to help you repopulate the area. Drop me a mail and I'll start the eggies!
  Posted 6 months ago by N2ZOrtolanaBlue | Permalink
- The more pigs the better! If a street is actually overpopulated, some of the animals will complain until one of them leaves, and balance will be restored automatically. Personally, I've been a bit perplexed and slightly annoyed by the sudden disappearance of a multitude of pigs in certain areas; perhaps this thread explains it.
  Posted 6 months ago by glum pudding | Permalink
- "I wonder what made them think that they had to clear the region of overcrowding? "
  You have to stop and put yourself in the other Glitch's shoes.
  Perhaps they are saying the very same thing but opposite.
  I wonder what made them think that they had to populate the region with pigs?
  Everything in Glitch makes perfect sense.
  Take all the crap and throw it in some SDBs.
  Grab your Focusing Orb and get to meditation.
  Munch on some purple and all will be ok.
  Remember to always keep an open mind and put yourself in the other Glitch's shoes.
  Posted 6 months ago by Eye Wonder | Permalink
- I think this can be settled easily by saying in game/ put notes that the piggies on tamila is taken care of. I agree with Eye wonder, it is double-edge sword.
  Posted 6 months ago by rosedragon | Permalink
- I'm also a member of P.I.G., but just like the RL PETA has militants and moderate so does P.I.G. I'm a moderate. I only rescue piggies that don't have a clear access to trees or ones that are "nibbled out" even when there are trees.
  Now I am not privy to the actual conversation you had, but perhaps it's better to step back and, as others before me have stated, think about it from the other person's perspective.
  Perhaps there were a lot of "nibbled out" piggies when that Glitch came around. It happens. Perhaps the P.I.G. member could have stated his/her case more amiably. Misunderstandings do happen.
  If, in the future, this happens again feel free to contact me in-game or via frog mail. I'll be more than happy to mediate.
  (Note: I'm not a ranking member of P.I.G., just one concerned about both sides)
  Posted 6 months ago by Mal'akh | Permalink
- "Who is to decide?" Well, it's your rant, so presumably you decide; the difficulty is in enforcing that decision.
  Posted 6 months ago by Janitch | Permalink
- Just to clarify a few points: The purpose of PIG is to relocate piggies from inhospitable areas to areas that are better suited to the needs of Ur's pixelated porcine as determined by the game structure itself. Piggies roam, therefore we try to give them as much roaming room as possible. They need to eat or they starve, so we make sure they have access to trees. They and other critters are made unhappy by overcrowding, so we thin accordingly. If a street has 11 piggies on it but they aren't complaining of crowding, then we'll tend to leave it alone, providing the street has enough trees and/or foot traffic to sustain the population. If those conditions aren't met, then we may choose to thin it out a bit. There are no hard and fast rules to piggy rescuing; rescue efforts are left to the best judgment of the individual rescuers. We may unintentionally bruise some feelings on occasion, but you won't meet a finer bunch of caring folks.
  As others have pointed out, everyone is entitled to their individual form of game play, providing it doesn't violate the TOS. When differences of game play do arise, there is the potential for conflict. PIG doesn't actively seek out conflict or confrontation, but our goals may be different from yours. In those cases, sometimes the best solution is simply a friendly conversation.
  We do not auction rescued critters for profit; we either find suitable homes or we relocate them to other public streets. Public areas are preferred, so that they remain in the domain of the general population. Also, if piggies have disappeared from a street, don't automatically assume it was part of a rescue. Piggies disappear from streets all the time, many of them to be sold at auction. One way to protest this piggy-nabbing behavior is simply by not purchasing hog-tied piggies on the market.
  PIG has close to 300 members, many of us active rescuers. And judging by the overwhelming amount of support we received during the housing quarter rescue, our efforts are largely appreciated. Our goal is not to cause hurt feelings, but rather to do our part in helping to make Ur a happy and safe place for critters and Glitchen alike. To that end, we do try our best to honor other forms of game play, within reason. If we are made aware that certain piggies are being cared for even if they are in an area we would deem as inhospitable, we will often respect that and leave them alone.
  We aren't a police force; we're just a bunch of individuals who care about our virtual world and its inhabitants, playing the game in ways that are meaningful to us. We're all free in this world to do as we choose; I embrace your right to play your game, and I cherish the same freedom for myself and for my fellow rescuers. I invite anyone who takes issue with our efforts to go to our group page which is open to public view and read our discussions to get a better feel for what we're about: http://www.glitch.com/groups/RA5NI4SRL1F2V7F/
  And if you have any questions or concerns, feel free to chat us up! As a wise woman friend once said, "There's no problem that can't be solved over a barbecue." Pop on over to my street and say hi...I've got beer. :)
  Posted 6 months ago by KitchWitch | Permalink
- I know that the intent of PIG is good. They do not want piggies to die for lack of food or to get sad due to overcrowding. I can assure you that my rescue piggies are spoiled as well as any could be and I truly love them. I rescued one of them myself as he was a favorite of mine from my street in Mien Evoke QTR. He gives me smiles daily and I pet him often. he has no lack of food or companions and seems very happy. He helps me remember how much I loved the old Qtrs, good memories!
  Posted 6 months ago by Brib Annie | Permalink
- The environmental features of Glitch that can be affected by users are entirely up to each person at the moment. This is why we get spice vs gas tree wars, wood tree wars, chickens in the mines wars, pigs in the swamps wars.... Even though Glitch has a strong and active community, there is no way to coordinate it. There is no way to announce something to the whole user community unless you are staff. There is no way to lock items like patches and animals on public streets to enforce a certain ecological balance. I have played other games where the staff built a voting system to let users choose leaders and select options for resource placement and restrictions. I promise you do ***NOT*** want to add politics to this game. All it does is prove that the best and the absolute WORST of human nature will always come out, even in a context where it can't affect anything important in real life.
  So, just realize that any preference you have for public areas will not be known or understood by other glitchen. They will constantly be eroded due to other glitchen's choices, which are also made based on ideas and values that are important to them and unknown to you. You have to decide for yourself whether the idea you have for maintaining the area the way you like is worth the effort you will have to put in to enforce it on other glitchen.
  Posted 6 months ago by KhaKhonsu | Permalink
- Piggies are hog wild: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgLfuARCe5k&feature=related
  And so are PIGs. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9nG0YUzyWQU
  :D
  Posted 6 months ago by KitchWitch | Permalink
- I for one have always appreciated that Tamila is an area of high piggy density and I've never found 10 pigs per streets is to be an unmanageably high number.
  I don't think perceived lack of footfall is a justifiable reason for relocating pigs from streets. Taken to its logical conclusion with the current distribution of glitches this would likely end up with all pigs in Groddle or on housing resource routes.
  In my opinion the presence of many pigs in Tamila is in itself a motivation to visit it regularly. Personally I prefer Ur to the HRRs and the idea of tightly packed piggies doesn't appeal to me despite the efficiency gains.
  Long live the Tamila piggies ;0)
  Posted 6 months ago by geekybird | Permalink
- +1 Rosencrantz
  Posted 6 months ago by Veghrt | Permalink
- Having access to trees does not necessarily mean that the pigs will be fed. As you can see here, even pigs marching back and forth past a cherry tree can go hungry: those pigs were on my street, the tree was tended daily, and the pigs were fed manually about half the time because they'd ignore the tending the other half.
  I didn't mean to imply that members of P.I.G. are the only ones removing pigs from streets, of course -- others do it too -- but the group's activities are probably more visible than those of individual players. Of course, capturing pigs is by no means against the rules of the game, and neither is moving them to another street or selling them to other players. I just don't think it's particularly helpful to anyone to move pigs around when the game has already taken all possibilities into account. It's also not helpful to assume that a pig which can't be nibbled indicates long-term neglect of a particular street, since they can get hungry in a matter of hours, but won't actually die until much later.
  Posted 6 months ago by glum pudding | Permalink
- If poorly fed piggies die, then logically there is a missing game mechanic at the other end - well fed piggies should reproduce.
  Posted 6 months ago by WalruZ | Permalink
- Oh, gosh, Walruz, that might be kind of awesome :) If piggies on streets that got a lot of traffic naturally multiplied...
  Posted 6 months ago by Liza Throttlebottom | Permalink
- KhaKhonsu, I really liked your post.
  Posted 6 months ago by diaveborn ♥ | Permalink
- 10 piggies can be enough to cause lag on my slow computer.
  Posted 6 months ago by roderick ordonez | Permalink
- I don't know if it was a member of PIG who dropped off a slew of piggies on my (tree filled) homestreet, but I left a note thanking them, named them all after muppets, and love them dearly.
  So, if whoever gifted me all the lovely piggies is reading this, thank you :)
  Posted 6 months ago by Aliera | Permalink
- Plus, don't forget, piglets are worth 40 iMG to donate! So that's 10 more than pig eggs! Maybe people are youthening them for shrinerating!
  Posted 6 months ago by Jimothy | Permalink
- Naw, even per use, Youth Potion cost a bunch more than buying a piglet.
  Posted 6 months ago by RawBean | Permalink