Topic

Rookish Script = Arabic?

In another thread about the lack of subtitles in the Rook Museum, transcripts of the audio were posted.

The transcript for the painting of the "Secret Rook Plans" includes "the only such artifact ever to fall into Glitchian hands — and the only example of Rookish script ever seen".

The inclusion of Arabic/Persian looking writing at the bottom made me think of the Roc from the One Thousand and One Nights, which for some reason hadn't occurred to me before. I think the writing says something like "renounce imagination", which makes sense, but I would be interested to hear from native speakers for a more trustworthy translation. Like a dope I didn't think to take a screen shot but maybe someone did and can post it?

Maybe more artifacts like this will be discovered as the game progresses, shedding more light on the mysterious Rook? Maybe there are other examples out there that I haven't noticed?

Posted 16 months ago by The Cat Face Subscriber! | Permalink

Replies

  • i'm working on some script and a few basic words of a language.

    interesting to watch talking crow/raven videos on youtube to see what sorts of sounds a crow language could be based on.
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I have weird sounding birds living in my chimney (hate this new place, but love my poor friends).  Anyways I should record it even though its not ravens or crows but it sure is creepy sounding
    Posted 16 months ago by Laurali Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I have always felt that Arabic is the world's most beautiful written language.  I cannot read it but I love to see it (just put politics, religion and other hot issues aside).  I am sorry that this is an issue but I can see why.  I might have expected more protest from Arabs than from others.  That image is small.  I suspect that most players did not even notice it.  It may have been better though to have invented something rather than use a known language.  I do like the message, "Imagine"!
    Posted 16 months ago by Brib Annie Subscriber! | Permalink
  • What are you using to do your script, @striatic? Should we team up with @Lord Bacon-o?
    Posted 16 months ago by Fokian Fool Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Oh man, can I get on the script-making bandwagon? D: I love making up languages~~
    Posted 16 months ago by Arii Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Arii - sounds like a plan. I'm game, but's up to the other two people I've mentioned. I'm maxxed on groups at the moment, but if you wanted to create one for such a project and invite me that would overcome such a limitation but, again, it's up to @striatic and @Lord Bacon-o.
    Posted 16 months ago by Fokian Fool Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "What are you using to do your script, @striatic? Should we team up with @Lord Bacon-o?"

    no.
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • English is the world's most beautiful written language and more masterpieces and great works have been written in English than any other language. Shakespeare for example.  All flight communication is in ENGLISH.   All international business is done in ENGLISH. PLease Giants. USE English as your first languge. Sorry but I am very steamed about this thread.  I cannot forget and will never forget 9-11.
    Posted 16 months ago by napabeth Subscriber! | Permalink
  • English is a beautiful language, and the best for complex expression in my opinion, but there's merit in learning other languages. It helps you learn about their culture and history, and some of them also sound beautiful. Arabic is a lovely language to hear or speak.
    Posted 16 months ago by Sid Soloveitchik Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I speak three languages fluently but they are Romance languages...To me they are more pleasing to   the ear.   Can you beat French as the language of love? Italian, good food and best art, Spanish, passion and fire.    De gustibus non est disputandum... there is no accounting for taste.
    If you love Arabic I suggest you watch it on telly.  You should yourself learn to speak Arabic.
    We must accept assimilation. Except for  Outer Mongolia there are few areas without multiple cultures living together. 
    Posted 16 months ago by napabeth Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @striatic - simple and to the point :)
    Actually I asked to avoid duplicate effort. 
    Posted 16 months ago by Fokian Fool Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Fokian Fool, @ striatic :       I suggest you offer a language for the museum  exhibits   to Tiny Speck ASAP

    you men who know the game can come up with something brilliant, easey peasey.
    Posted 16 months ago by napabeth Subscriber! | Permalink
  • here's a rookish language and script based on the kinds of sounds that crows can make and the sorts of letters they might form by scratching with their claws and pecking with their beaks.

    the script is inspired by cuneiform, the written language of the Sumerian city of Ur.

    the language is phonetic and alphabetic, with 11 letters [because the glitch world is full of primes like that]

    the "spoken" language probably originated from whatever language was used for naming the giants, as the rookish transliteration of "alph" aligns with the rookish word for imagination, which is fitting since alpha is the most inventive of the giants.

    there are other little tricks in there too, and you can try to guess what RENEER means, nice i forgot to include the english word ; ]

    http://striatic.net/misc/glitch/rookish.jpg
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @striatic - Cool! I'm guessing that "eS" and "Teh" are beak marks?

    And your name in Rookish is a good touch. :D
    Posted 16 months ago by Fokian Fool Subscriber! | Permalink
  • RENEER is "World" 
    Posted 16 months ago by Fokian Fool Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I think you guys are on to something big. I see movie rights in your future.
    Mt Rainier
    Prince Rainier of Monoco
    How do you pronounce  RENEER ????
    Posted 16 months ago by napabeth Subscriber! | Permalink
  • yes, those are beak peck marks.

    i'm guessing that in it's most primitive state, rookish script is formed by scratching and pecking straight through the stripped bark of a bean, spice or cherry tree. when you'd hold the bark up to the light you'd be able to see right through the letters on the page.

    but a rook could dip one of their feet in ink to write on normal paper tree paper, or write in the dirt by way of scratches.

    i've tried speaking the language and it works well with a very gravelly, raspy voice. i can get the 'V' to sound natural but i think it would be cool if the "V" sound was perhaps enhanced by a flap of the rook's wing in order to help it make the sound.

    the one big problem i have with the spoken language is that it has no "L" sound so you wouldn't want to transliterate too many english words into it or else it would sound like broken 'asiatic' english, and possibly a bit offensive. it's weird because after listening to a bunch of talking crow/raven videos on youtube, the crows can't manage an L very well in the middle of a word but the ravens seem quite adept at it.

    some other tricks in there .. thought and life are the same concept and share a word, Va, which makes sense in regards to the metaphysics of glitch. Va in french is the present tense for "Go", which fits "life" well. Ne is the word no, or suffix 'not' when combined with other words. Neva is thus "not life", or "death" .. need to figure out a meaning for "Nor" so that rooks can say "Neva Nor" and sound vaguely like something out of Poe.
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Lol, Stri, why does your concept paper look like it was unearthed from a Rookish pyramid? XD  Or was it just THAT MUCH COFFEE? ;D
    Posted 16 months ago by FlirtyvonSexenhaven Subscriber! | Permalink
  • RENEER is supposed to mean mountain, and pronounced a little bit like "Rainier" but more like "Ree Near"

    the rook probably share the same word for the world, Ur, except they'd pronounce it Or.

    EDIT: actually, they might have a call like "KAOR! KAOR!" which would be sort of an all-purpose claim on absolutely everything in existence. [Ka = Me/My/Mine, Or = Ur, World .. Kaor! = My World!]

    most of the words related to the glitch cosmology, name of the world, giant names, should sound vaguely familiar from english to rookish, and some very basic concepts sound similar as well .. "EeR/Air" .. but the further away from the basic concepts you get, the more foreign rookish should sound.

    something like a hoe [the tool] would probably be called .. i dunno .. like an "Earth Fighter" or something. or maybe an ENEERAGA, "Old Earth New Thing" with GA meaning "thing".
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "Lol, Stri, why does your concept paper look like it was unearthed from a Rookish pyramid?"

    because it was!
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Ha!  But you don't have any SAND on your BOOTS.  DUN DUN DUUUUUUNNN Also, can we now hear your recordings of the scratchy voice striatic bird language? XD pleeeeze we promise to laugh with you! <3
    Posted 16 months ago by FlirtyvonSexenhaven Subscriber! | Permalink
  • o mans.

    i'll think about recording some rookish tomorrow when it won't wake up my wife.
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I rather liked the look of the original script, its cursive, foreign appearance gave it an air of ancient mysticism, ideal for the history of the rook. The straight, hard lines are rather cold and precise for such an emotive subject imho.
    Posted 16 months ago by Morticia Addams Subscriber! | Permalink
  • all the letters curve into one another when possible, i've just put sharper corners in the example to make it look more like cuneiform. they could be softened to the point where they are even less angular than the arabic.

    it is just a matter of how the words are written, there's nothing about the script that requires angularity. it's versatile that way.
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • i also thought this would be a fun project.  however, my ideas seem too fancy. each time i try to think rookish i wanna make bird morse code. ^^;
    Posted 16 months ago by FlirtyvonSexenhaven Subscriber! | Permalink
  • here is an example of more curvaceous, calligraphic rookish.

    http://striatic.net/misc/glitch/rookishcali1.jpg
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "i also thought this would be a fun project.  however, my ideas seem too fancy. each time i try to think rookish i wanna make bird morse code. ^^;"

    then do bird morse code. who says there should only be one rookish language anyway?
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • ok .. finally last one i swear but these things are fun to make.

    the word "Rook/Rok" in two different styles ..

    http://striatic.net/misc/glitch/rooktwice.jpg

    possibly suitable for some manner of rook emblem as well.
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Wow. Missed the whole discussion (and I do believe I was the first to point out the Rookish script looked too Arabic way back in the Museum thread), skimmed quickly to see it develop in very interesting ways, read Stoot's reply, and now at the end, a delicious conclusion: Striatic's rook script.

    Wow. :D

     Love it!!!!! 
    Posted 16 months ago by Cefeida Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Nice job with the possible Rookish script, Striatic. I like the bottom one in this one:

    striatic.net/misc/glitch/ro...
    Posted 16 months ago by Shepherdmoon Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @cefeida

    swear to zille the controversial religious/cultural topics almost always end extremely well.

    got the SiH tombstones out of the last one.

    @shepherdmoon

    i've actually done a couple more calligraphic rookish stuff i haven't posted. figured out some ways to make shorter words look elegant.
    Posted 16 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Think of the Rosetta Stone. Create a language that is a combination of three ancient texts.
    Posted 16 months ago by napabeth Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Heh, I finally got around to doing this.  Similar to Striatic, I was convinced that Rooks neded a simplistic language built around bird speech.  However, I was even more simplistic.  Perhaps I don't get Rook society at this point; the only thing I know is they are boring.  So, here's my boring language! ^^;

    FvS's rook lang

    Sorry for the mess.  Striatic's effort really puts mine to shame! ;D  I decided early on that I wanted to make a brush for the three-claw bird writing effect, but in all honesty I think it looks better done more carefully by hand.  Maybe someone more talented with a similar brush could make it work better.   In all, it's a pretty incomplete idea; anyone feel free to co-opt any/all of the ideas and also feel free to contact me if you want to collaborate!
    Posted 16 months ago by FlirtyvonSexenhaven Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Those are beautiful, striatic!
    Posted 16 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I am sadly lacking a scanner or decent paint program so I am muddling through in between actual pay-the-bills work.

    I decided to not even try to worry about pronunciation under the assumption that Glitchian ears can't distinguish the subtle tone shifts, etc, that Rookish uses. (And I'm lazy.) I just thought about the physical process of writing if one were a bird.

    Here is Rookiform numbers. Later I'll whip up something with word and sentence structure.
    Posted 16 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink
  • From noticing the script to begin with. To figuring out what it said. To the discussion. To the creation of new rookish language... wow! You guys are really something. :)
    Posted 16 months ago by emdot Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Rookiform sample.
    I pictured a rook standing on the ground and writing in the dirt, using talons and beak. It's written starting at the top and going down, as the rook hops backwards. When the rook reaches the edge of the writing area (later, the edge of the parchment), it turns around. So it is read in a zig zag - top down and then bottom up and then top down, etc.

    (It is sometimes written on trees. In this case it is written in a spiral around the trunk of the tree.)

    The letters of a single word are connected my a horizontal line scratched with the tip of the beak. The actual letters are written to the right side of the line. The left side of the line are numerous modifies: tense, plurals, marking as verb, etc.. The end of sentences are marked by three parallel scratches. See here.

    The actual marking of letter are mostly various downward strokes due to the difficulty of clawing in an upward manner. There are occasional up mark is made using the back toe. "Dots" can be made with the beak or a poke of a claw.

    Although not seen here, much information is conferred by how the letters and modifiers and lines are written. A light (shallow) mark means less or slighter. A darker (deepers) mark might indicate more intensity of something. Much of the subtly of Rookiform poetry comes from this.
    Posted 16 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Nice work, all! These look lovely.
    Posted 16 months ago by Melody Pond Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Your Lordship, I notice that The Rook apparently don't have a concept of zero? ;)
    Posted 16 months ago by Arii Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Wow Striatic, I have to say that is really cool.  Three points:

    1) It looks realistic and fitting for Rooks
    2) You have incredibly good handwriting for a male, because most men I know have ugly handwriting (in my opinion)
    3) You have finally impressed me, which probably means nothing to you, but a lot to me

    Good job!
    Posted 16 months ago by Laurali Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Thanks @Stoot for the response... Thanks @Striatic for the work on a script! You are both what's is SO RIGHT about this game!
    Posted 16 months ago by Dr007 Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Arii, not quite. Actually the reverse. They have the concept of nil and nothing, but it is more of a pure state so is not used in their number system.

    Here are some word modifiers. (As stated yesterday, my concept is a too complicated to be of any use. But I just enjoy the though experiment.)

    I'm also developing around the idea that Rooks don't really have lies. They have various forms of knowing whether something is known or not but not made up lies. They can see a shape in the distant and it may be a person or may be a tree, but until it is proven to be one of the other they can't assume fully it is either. It is more likely a man or a tree based on observation and experience but rooks would never say that it is actually one or the other. (Lack of imagination and all that.)
    Posted 16 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I just noticed another thing that his lordship said -- "Much of the subtly of Rookiform poetry comes from this."
    Whaaaaaat, the rook don't write poetry. Poetry is creative and imaginative!

    I agree with Laurali, Striatic. Your alphabet is top-notch. I don't think I could improve on it. :) I would like to know more about the language itself--for example, I see that it is agglutinative, as in your example of RE (large) + NEER (earth) = RENEER (world), and NEE (not) + EER (sky) = NEER (earth)--it's very sense-making.
    But do adjectives come before or after the word they modify? (ETA: Upon  closer inspection, I see that they come before, as in EEROK.)
    Are there cases (genitive, dative, etc)?
    Do verbs conjugate?
    Is there a formal 'you'? If so, does it have its own conjugation?
    How do prepositions work?

    In terms of the alphabet, what are the rules for positioning the horizontal scratches? If there is another vertical stroke later in the word, do they continue as far as that mark, or is there a maximum limit? If there is no later downstroke, when does the horizontal stroke stop?
    Posted 16 months ago by Arii Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "Poetry is creative and imaginative!"
    Ah, but Rooks can write about beauty and what they see as beauty. 
    But rooks to not have fiction. They have history but not fiction.
    We know they have enough creativity to come up with battle/attack plans (see museum).
    Posted 16 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Okay, that's a fair point. :)
    Posted 16 months ago by Arii Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Well, I do have the stuff to convert any of your hand drawn things into an actual font. In fact it works better if I do come from a picture. For what it's worth I do have an actual set of cuneiform fonts on hand. I don't think it looks appropriate, especially after what I've seen here so far. Numbers, letters, and a small vocabulary so far. I feel like there is something missing.  I guessed "World" from RENEER because it is composed of the parts for "large" and "earth".  

    I'm going with @striatic's first list. It looks more comprehensive and complete despite the lack of numbers. 
    @Lord Bacon-o - you've given them a base-10 number system even though they only possess 6 digits ( if you allow a beak, 8 if you allow the wings). I've seen human societies with differing number systems. Watching a village go 1,2...5, Many!, Many Many!! was very educational. Just a thought.

    Using the 17 possible sound symbols created by @striatic an allowing for simplicity's sake a 6-syllable word size maximum, we get a potential vocabulary of 17+17*17+17*17*17+....+17*17*17*17*17*17 different words. That comes to a vocabulary of: 25,646,166 possible words! The average English speaker has a vocabulary of about 10k words. Winston Churchill was estimated to have an active vocabulary of about 20k words. The entire English language (which has the largest known vocabulary) has around 1-2 million words. @striatic's rooks are onto something. :)
    Posted 16 months ago by Fokian Fool Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I didn't see your response, @Lord Bacon-o. Zero in mathematics does not represent "nothing". It's one of the two basic identities 0&1. :) Dividing by zero yields infinity, but to divide by nothing means to divide not at all.
    Posted 16 months ago by Fokian Fool Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Fokian, you clearly didn't look closely. It's base 8 (but lacking a zero). They have 8 claws total (three front toes, one back tow).
    Posted 16 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Back tow..... in that like under tow?
    Posted 16 months ago by napabeth Subscriber! | Permalink
  • yes, napa. They use their back toe to drag things under them before they eat the them.

    @Fokian, fair enough in regards to zero. I honestly wasn't giving it a whole lot of though. Nor do I think do Rooks. They don't strike me as mathematicians.
    Posted 16 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink