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#### What is the base age for the game?

I am 11 and some of the funny commentary might be inappropriate for younger kids like my 7 brother who would, frankly, love the game. What do you guys think?

Posted 24 months ago by Test123Nat | Permalink

### Replies

- alpha.glitch.com/forum/gene...
  This is not a kids game, as has been stated by the creator himself.
  "This is definitely not a game intended for kids." - stoot
  It is meant to have an adult air, and there are many alternative games that are great for a younger audience. Glitch is not one of those games. By removing all of the kid-unfriendly aspects, there would be quite a large hole in the game. There are so many references and gags that rely on knowledge a 7-year-old wouldn't have.
  There is tons more in the thread I linked to.
  Posted 24 months ago by Bingobar | Permalink
- .. and I think that's rather sad.
  because glitch seems like it could be a rare MMO that families might play together.
  i don't have any sub 16 year old kids, so it is no skin off my back but it does seem like a somewhat high cut off.
  if there were a ton of realtime family MMOs maybe I'd think differently, but I'm not sure the handful of chuckles I get from all the sexual references is really worth excluding family play.
  Posted 24 months ago by striatic | Permalink
- Yes, striatic. But you must also consider the other, larger implications of having a kid-friendly, realtime MMO.
  Filtering of chat text.
  Online predator safeguards.
  COPA adherence.
  Much more support and support "noise".
  And on and on.
  It's not as easy as "let's just remove sex jokes".
  Posted 24 months ago by Bingobar | Permalink
- :D
  Posted 24 months ago by Test123Nat | Permalink
- What Bingobar said, basically.
  Some parents let their kids drink a little wine with dinner or watch movies which the censor boards have recommended only for those a bit older. It depends on the kids and it depends on the parents.
  But if you want to make and market a beverage or a movie, you have to make a decision about what you want it to be, and find a way to fit in to the society and the culture, the laws and the habits.
  "Kids" + "online" is such a fraught and emotionally laden combination of concepts and we don't really want to get in to heavily policing or serious regulatory compliance. We're not, it should be obvious, going out of our way to be especially "adult" or especially gross or shock anyone … we're just not going to design for kids or market to kids or say Glitch is for kids since it is not (though there may be kids out there who would be perfectly fine playing it and parents who would be perfectly fine with them playing it).
  Posted 24 months ago by stoot barfield | Permalink
- Ok bringing this thread back. After playing all weekend and generally going all over the Glitch world, I noticed in Global and Live chat thet seemed to be a huge influx of children, who a, don't understand the game as it is, or b, want to annoy others gameplay.
  I'm not against mature kids over 16ish that comprehend the the way Glitch is intended to be played, there some great kids on here, but I would surely hate to see what to me is an amazing game ruined by underage and unsupervised kids. Is there going be an age limit in the Tou? I don't want to get attached to a game and have to leave because of unruley kids.
  Thanks Anne :)
  Posted 19 months ago by ~Annie~ | Permalink
- Even if they state an age limit and say "no intended for children," there is no way to enforce it. There WILL be unruly kids. That is a fact. Just is. How everyone else handles it will make a difference in how much that affects the world/experience. (Learn to love the block button.)
  Posted 19 months ago by Lord Bacon-o | Permalink
- Age limitations can be verified at signup, as usual, providing a credit or debit card or confirmation of a PayPal or other online payment service etc.
  I also noticed yesterday there seemed to be a huge number of questions easily answered by at the glitch wikii or just playing the game, but didn't realize these were kids.
  Having too many kids inWorld will also hamper social interactions, as how many 6-12...or ? are going to be able to talk peer-to-peer with adults?
  Posted 19 months ago by MeherMan | Permalink
- I am 17 and don't own a credit card and I would rather not give out such numbers anyway (I trust you stoot but I was brought up to be careful). Kids can also get their parents numbers, I have known some really irresponsible parents.
  Posted 19 months ago by Ani Laurel | Permalink
- I'm 30: my daughter's 3. We both enjoy the game, for different reasons. As she gets older, and she starts to read better, I'll simply turn the global chat off.
  Posted 19 months ago by La Esponja Grande | Permalink
- I'm really seriously against having to provide online financial information to sign up for a free game. Providing your parents financial information is simple, and the requirement doesn't really stop underage players from being in the game.
  And from my experience in several other Help Forums, not reading the wiki and asking questions that can be answered just by playing the game is no indication at all of age.
  If your social interactions are being hampered, I'd suggest you stick with a group. Again, age has nothing to do with the ability/willingness of a player to engage in "peer-to-peer" conversations. If I run by you while I'm on my way home from mining, you aren't going to get any adult conversation either.
  Posted 19 months ago by WindBorn | Permalink
- I can't see that the game as such is not suitable for sensible kids. Often those causing a nuisance are not children!
  However, I would hate to be censored in any way in playing or talking so I think it is wise to say "over 16 only" then any parent can be aware that there may be unsuitable content and can decide whether or not they allow younger people to play.
  Some of the youngest players here are some of the most responsible, helpful and entertaining.
  Posted 19 months ago by Cassandria | Permalink
- I think it's a very good idea to make sure everyone sees an age limit,as well as a statement saying that this game is intended for, and played by adults,and therefore there will be things unsuitable for children,all this can be done when a new player signs up to play,one page,with big bright red writing,just before they enter their details.No, it will not stop all children,but at least no-one can say there was no warning.
  Posted 19 months ago by ~Scilly~ | Permalink
- @ScillyGirl5
  What you are describing (without the bright red writing) is called Terms Of Service. Almost every site you join has a TOS that you must agree to before you can join the site.
  I'd suggest you spend some time reading the TOS of sites you are a member of. Facebook would be a good start. Every single sentence in the TOS is important, and legally binding. There's way too much to make into a single page of bright red writing.
  Most people just check the box saying "I agree" and don't ever get around to reading what they have agreed to. And, believe it or not, people still say there was no warning.
  Posted 19 months ago by WindBorn | Permalink
- @ WindBorn, I hear you ~that is why it is important to make an un-missable point of it at the time of signing. It was a big issue at a previous game I played,where some adult players were literally scolded,and accused of being 'child-stalkers' by some parents looking over their kid's shoulder,and (for whatever reason) didn't fully realise,that the game was actually created and intended for adults,and not children.
  And I know about TOS,I was merely stating it would be a good idea to make a point of any age limits.
  Posted 19 months ago by ~Scilly~ | Permalink
- But the point is that Every Single Sentence in the TOS is equally important, from a legal standpoint. There is no way to select just one idea and make it the main point of the sign in screen.
  Posted 19 months ago by WindBorn | Permalink
- WindBorn, that's totally not the case. You can easily add a check box for age verification (and many sites do). Lines in the Terms Of Service may be equally binding, but some parts can be more equal than others.
  Of course, that's not going to stop people who are below the age range from signing up — but it does give Tiny Speck a get-out clause, and give parents and so on a warning. If nothing else, it also gives us a way out of these conversations about whether Glitch is for kids, whether things should be censored and so on.
  Posted 19 months ago by wurzel | Permalink
- @ WindBorn, again, I hear you! The original question was,about whether, or not, a 7year old is too young to be here;or an eleven year old,for that matter.From a legal point both are too young to agree to the TOS,and, really,to play in any game geared toward adult players.
  However legal age has surprisingly little to do with a person's maturity; it is virtually impossible to police a person's level of maturity,in direct contrast to policing a person's actual, legal age.
  The TOS are a type of legal contract,however a minor (child) cannot legally enter into such a contract,and, knowing how easy it is to deceive anyone on line,it seems only prudent for a company to make a specific point of stating any/all age restrictions (and big enough so no-one can say "I didn't see that") before you even start filling in the details to sign up. If the need were to arise,Tiny Speck can then point to this clearly stated warning,and argue,it is not Tiny Speck's responsibility to monitor a minor's behaviour,but it is the parents/legal guardians that carry that responsibility.
  Posted 19 months ago by ~Scilly~ | Permalink
- TS is not going to ignore their lawyers and base their TOS and sign-up page on legal advice from their General Forum members. You can be sure that whatever language there is in the TOS is based on the advice of the people who will have to defend them in court, not us.
  Posted 19 months ago by WindBorn | Permalink
- Sure, I don't think anyone's offering legal advice... apart from you!
  I'm just not sure why you're saying it's not possible to upfront age during signup. I've had experience with a lot of TOS, but I've never seen anyone else suggesting that it would be invalidated by asking somebody to state that they are of age.
  At least it would bring the need for these conversations about age-appropriateness to an end.
  Also, worth looking at the team's previous form on this stuff: Flickr's TOS is a good example of how you make it relatively simple. It's got some age-related bits in it.
  Posted 19 months ago by wurzel | Permalink
- I think it's blatantly obvious that TS would consult highly specialised lawyers for setting up their TOS. I don't see how stating that a minor child cannot legally enter into a legally binding contract; how easy it is to genuinely miss any age recommendations; and how easy it would be to lie about ones age; I don't see how any of that could be seen as me trying to advise TS. I merely said that I think it is a very good idea to make a point of stating age restrictions/age recommendations, in view of this game being created with adults in mind.Nothing more. I would honestly prefer to know there are no under age players here,but I live in the real world and I know there are, I just hope they stay safe. And that brings me back to what was originally asked: do I think a 7year young child (or anyone under the age of 16years for that matter) is to young to play here? The short answer is: Yes.
  Posted 19 months ago by ~Scilly~ | Permalink
- I'm aware of the problems of immaturity, and understand that the only realistic way to curtail the number of immature players is to limit the allowed age, or at least discourage younger players from joining. However, I am only 15. If the way I am treated by both peers and adults IRL is any indication, maturity is not an area in which I struggle. I wouldn't appreciate any limits on Glitch, as I enjoy this game very much and will recommend it to all my (mature) friends as soon as it becomes open to the public.
  I see your points.
  I really hope they aren't carried out to any extreme measures.
  Posted 19 months ago by Put Q. Simply | Permalink
- I'm pretty young - won't say how old exactly, but in my lower teens. Anyhow, I love the game and I don't think I'm TOO much of a nuisance to anyone :) in fact, many people were surprised when I said I was young ('nother thread) so, Meherman, there are SOME young people who can interact with adults :P I would hate, hate, hate for this to become a children's game, but I don't think anyone needs to worry - it's not going to.
  Posted 19 months ago by Cupcake | Permalink
- regardless of what age limit they put on the game on the internet or in game it makes pretty much no difference at all to who is playing the game. since age limits can be lied about or parents or someone older could make an account with real info if it needed verified. and then the younger just keep quite about the age. age is something that is almost impossible to censor as far as gamers go. as far as most games go this hasnt anything that will disturb a childs mind like 80% of current games out there. of course im not saying make it a childish game with a low age rating. but even if that age rating is set to 18. it will stop pretty much no one playing under that age. majority of the adult content is just soft slang type words. no blood being splatted or anything like that.
  and as for maturity or behaving in a decent manner. I've found over the years it is the adults in early and mid 20s that act the most like children in games.
  Posted 19 months ago by Hootaholic | Permalink
- "I think it's a very good idea"
  Good idea for whom? What good does it do "to make a point of stating age restrictions/age recommendations"? Who does that help?
  It's also a good idea to clearly state TS's position on intellectual property rights, and what rights a player has to in-game content that they create.
  The point is that there are many, many issues that TS has to make clear to people who are considering using their site. The lawyers aren't going to let them focus on one to the exclusion of the others. Every screen that is presented to a potential player will have to be reviewed by the lawyers to make sure TS is covering all the important stuff. And there's a lot of important stuff, not just IP rights and age limits.
  We can't sit here and tell TS what they "should" say and what points they "should" make. That's the job of their legal advisors, not their fans in the General Forum.
  Posted 19 months ago by WindBorn | Permalink
- WindBorn, I think you're getting way off topic here by going back into this stuff about lawyers, legal advisors and so on. What's confusing and exasperating to me about this sudden shift in direction is that it just doesn't make sense. We're not talking, necessarily, about Terms of Service — in fact, what we've discussed is probably more in disclaimer territory. And if you think that it's legally insane to make age-appropriateness visible over terms & conditions, then I'd advise you to take a look at the regulation for age certification in media. Games, movies, etc: it's everywhere.
  Or take Facebook, which has a mere 600 million users: it has an age disclaimer built in, right up front in the sign-up process. I quote:
  "Facebook requires all users to provide their real date of birth to encourage authenticity and provide only age-appropriate access to content. You will be able to hide this information from your profile if you wish, and its use is governed by the Facebook Privacy Policy."
  Does that invalidate the rest of the TOS, or make it legally dubious? I'm sure Mark Zuckerberg's lawyers (who get to flex their muscles more often than most) are pretty OK with this way of doing things, even though — or perhaps because — it's largely a legal backup, rather than a definitive block on younger users signing up.
  The wider point, though, is that this is a discussion forum and saying "hey, we shouldn't bother talking about this because it's Tiny Speck's business" is kind of missing the point. We're not offering anything remotely like legal advice. We're just wondering out loud and (from what I can tell) trying to work out whether Stewart's previous messages of "Glitch is not intended for children, and so we're not going out of our way to make it family-friendly" have gotten through to all players.
  Of *course* everything is in the hands of Tiny Speck and its legal team, who I am sure are well remunerated for their expertise. There is no harm in exploring the issues, though, to see what real data and opinions are out there. It's great to see, for example, that there are some younger players who seem much more able to cope with the game's humour than older players might give them credit for.
  In the end, you don't find things like that out by saying "no point talking, because this is lawyer stuff".
  Posted 19 months ago by wurzel | Permalink
- PS sorry if that got long or ranty. I have had an age-appropriate amount of wine this evening.
  Posted 19 months ago by wurzel | Permalink
- Is it possible to make a poll here about users age? - for example I'm 28 and I'm just curious ;-)
  Posted 19 months ago by Iskie Bae | Permalink
- @Patt... Misha ran one at the end of alpha with mixed reviews. If you're up for the potential bickering (and potential hilarity because some of the responses were a riot) fee free to start a new thread about it : ) You'll get the best responses from anonymous groupings.
  Posted 19 months ago by Travinara | Permalink
- Thank you wurzel, +1 =)
  Well,it's morning here,and I've been sipping my industrial strength coffee while reading the forums here. While I fully understand and respect what all people are saying here,I don't understand why one person feels the need to lecture on something that has nothing to do with the discussion here,and in such a belittling way...maybe my coffee hasn't kicked in yet.
  Posted 19 months ago by ~Scilly~ | Permalink
- @wurzel
  While your facebook citation is a good example it, it is also a bad one. Read this article to see why:
  www.zdnet.com/blog/facebook...
  Here's a quote from the first paragraph:
  "Facebook’s Statement of Rights and Responsibilities require users of the social network to be at least 13 years old (and even older, in some jurisdictions). 7.5 million of the 20 million minors on Facebook in the past year were younger than 13"
  Posted 19 months ago by frenchphenom | Permalink
- Even more timely, Zuckerburger himself said yesterday:
  "My philosophy is that for education you need to start at a really, really young age. Because of the [legal] restrictions we haven't even begun this learning process. If they're lifted then we'd start to learn what works."
  www.telegraph.co.uk/technol...
  Posted 19 months ago by katlazam | Permalink
- Well, it's easier to say that when you have 7.5 million subscribers breaking the user agreement.
  People learn what works by trial and error. We learn from the moment we are young that you don't take candy from strangers. His failure is not seeing that education does start at a young age, I'd be interested to know how these legal restrictions pose as an obstacle for education according to his philosophy.
  With that said, I can't see Tiny Speck not implementing something of a minimum age requirement in the Terms of Agreement. This will cover their 'six' in the event that some overly protective parent wants to sue them for all they have. This, of course, won't stop anyone from lying about their age.
  Edited for horrendous English... been speaking French way too long >.<
  Posted 19 months ago by frenchphenom | Permalink
- I for one will be interested to see what changes happen to Facebook when Zuckerburger is the proud owner of his very own 13-year-old-girl.
  Posted 19 months ago by Travinara | Permalink
- "Zuckerburger". I approve. :)
  Posted 19 months ago by Hburger | Permalink