Topic

Why do we still have produce vendors?

You got rid of the vendors (and stuff from vendors) that we can make. We cant buy herbs, so why can we still buy produce?

Wouldnt it make sense to get rid of the produce vendors so that those growing produce could make money off it?

Posted 11 months ago by Innie✿, Obviously Subscriber! | Permalink

Replies

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  • I would guess that the market for produce is FAR larger (and more complex - what is it, 12 or 16 different items?) than that for high-end tools and hooch, and therefore demand still outweighs supply by quite a bit. Can't confirm that, of course, since I have no access to the actual data. But 

    Although I actually would enjoy herb vendors, having none is probably a useful experiment for the developers, since it is an emerging market totally dependent on player supply.
    Posted 11 months ago by Gronkles McGee Subscriber! | Permalink
  • still left over from beta ?? - www.glitch.com/items/radish/
    Posted 11 months ago by BlackWolf Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Was trying to see if there was anything the vendor sold that we can't grow yet and ran across that in the encyclopedia ...
    Posted 11 months ago by BlackWolf Subscriber! | Permalink
  • The radish was never something grown.... think of it as something like Senoir Mr Fuinpickle, except for the alpha testers I think.
    Posted 11 months ago by SlimeNose the Erst Subscriber! | Permalink
  • aw i would love to grow radishes :D 
    Posted 11 months ago by satarell Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Then you might as well get rid of the gardening vendors too...since you can make most of the seeds by feeding piggies...and tinkerers can make most of the tools...gnomes could be shifted to the Tool or Hardware vendors.  It is odd what they choose to sell and what they choose not to sell at this point...
    Posted 11 months ago by Uniquely Prime Subscriber! | Permalink
  • there where turnips too how cute :D 
    Posted 11 months ago by satarell Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Guess you need to keep this in mind -
    New glitches don't have houses, or at least not under the current housing setup, so the only place they are going to be able to get veggies is at a vendor. since they don't have gardens.
    Posted 11 months ago by BlackWolf Subscriber! | Permalink
  • They can use the community gardens like those that want to do herbal gardening, but there has been no bog housing posted in weeks now...and all homes have been sold out for quite a while...of course, there is still plenty of gardening housing available in the listings right now...they could always buy one...
    Posted 11 months ago by Uniquely Prime Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Guess you need to keep this in mind - New glitches don't have houses, or at least not under the current housing setup, so the only place they are going to be able to get veggies is at a vendor. since they don't have gardens.

    Why couldn't they get them from other players via the auctions?    For that matter, why couldn't all tools be removed now so that tinkerers, refiners and ingot rubbers could have a market? 
    Posted 11 months ago by WalruZ Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I try to buy all my veggies from the auctions but some things are in short supply. If the produce vendors were gone, home grown veggies would become more valuable (much as the herbs did). Good or bad - not sure. It would reward the farmers and might spur me into using my 16 plot garden which sits dry and lifeless these days.
    Posted 11 months ago by Kookaburra Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I do infact make money from gardening. I grow approximately 1000 potatoes every 24 hours and turn them into almost 500 hooches. I use the produce vendor to buy the foods I need for cooking because it's cost effective to buy them rather than taking my garden out of hooch production for foods I will eat.
    Posted 11 months ago by Octo Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Personally, I love living next door to a produce vendor.  When I want to grill up 11 Lemburgers, I need 11 tomatoes, not 50 or 100.  I can just run out to market for the tomatoes, and I keep the rest of the ingredients handy.

    Really, who wants to eat month-old tomatoes?
    Posted 11 months ago by The Missing Finger Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Because produce is used in more things that are, you know, necessary.

    Tinctures and potions are gravy. You don't need them to keep playing. Food and the tools to cook it actually are necessary, because you can only get so many quoins per day and your energy constantly goes down.

    For that reason alone, I'm very against removing all vendors from the game. I can understand making certain things player made only, like certain vegetables that are used in better recipes but not required for most. The same goes for tools.

    Player controlled economies always inflate and leave new players over the barrel, and doing that with items that are needed just to continue playing is a horrible mistake.

    Edit: Doing it with tools that you need to use that skill you just learned is none to bright either. My solution would be to make player made versions that don't break as quickly. Otherwise you're going to see frying pans selling for 10k currants (or the equivalent)
    Posted 11 months ago by Valzemodeus Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Pruduce is no more necessary than tinctures and potions. You can harvest, nibble, and squeeze your way around Ur, never eating anything more advanced than grain, meat, cherries, bubbles...
    I say it's time for the produce vendors to go bye-bye.
    Posted 11 months ago by Syruss Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I'm too lazy to grow food.
    Posted 11 months ago by lalalei2001 Subscriber! | Permalink
  • This will probably be one of the first vendors to go in the new changes that will be happening soon (phasing out NPC vendors in favor of a player-only market). I can only see gardening vendors as being necessary (but TS will probably phase those out too).

    --Enjoy the produce vendors while you still can.
    Posted 11 months ago by Shepherdmoon Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "Pruduce is no more necessary than tinctures and potions. You can harvest, nibble, and squeeze your way around Ur, never eating anything more advanced than grain, meat, cherries, bubbles...
    I say it's time for the produce vendors to go bye-bye."


    That, I agree with that 100%
    Posted 11 months ago by Innie✿, Obviously Subscriber! | Permalink
  • The above will change when energy-intensive things like projects come back. 
    Posted 11 months ago by Shepherdmoon Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I seriously doubt I could eat the 900 to 1500 energy perday just from cherries, meat, grain and beans.
    Posted 11 months ago by Octo Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Octo, I eat only meat and drink only milk.  *shrug*  However, the produce I need to grow myself and then I get seeds from the produce I grew from feeding my piggies.
    Posted 11 months ago by Innie✿, Obviously Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Octo, really xD? Not to be rude, but gathering 90-150 meat is about two or three streets worth of effort :P That is extremely doable in a day xD
    Posted 11 months ago by Liza Throttlebottom Subscriber! | Permalink
  • In the housing thread that's somewhere in this forum, stoot says that one of their long-term goals is to eventually eliminate game-run vendors.  Although that is a long-term goal and probably won't begin to happen until after the new housing system is put in place.

    He also mentions, at the end of the post I linked, that there are some major economic changes and an overhaul of the crafting system coming.  I think it was on page 2 of that thread that he says the next major change will happen in about 8 weeks.  Whether it's the economic, crafting, or housing changes, he didn't say.

    So for now it's probably best to let the Produce vendors be.

    [edit]  Actually, now that I think about it, it's also quite possible that they could be removed in the next big update.  That would count as a major economic change, right?
    Posted 11 months ago by Sindee☆Cyanide Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Removing the produce vendors would have almost zero effect on the game.  People would grow a few more veggies in their plots and put them up for auction.  Veggie auctions would be more active but it's unlikely they would inflate unreasonably.     For a month or so people would pop into global and say "where are the produce vendors?" and they would be told to go buy what they want off the auction, much like has happened with hooch and tree poison.    This is why I favor eliminating tools from vendors list.   Players should buy them from other players at auction and recirculate currents between players.  
    Posted 11 months ago by WalruZ Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Liza,

    90-150 meat in 3 streets?

    Not everyone has Animal Kinship VII, nor wants to need it.
    Posted 11 months ago by Valzemodeus Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I've never understood the produce vendor's usefulness, when all crops are readily available at auction. Crop harvests are quite large and leave room for sell-off. I've never had a problem finding cheap tomatoes at auction when I need 'em.
    Posted 11 months ago by N2ZOrtolanaBlue Subscriber! | Permalink
  • That's because vendors keep them in check.

    There's no reason for anyone to pay 50 currants per spinach when they can walk to a produce vendor and buy them for 4. You remove vendors, you remove price ceilings which means that auction bots can walk in and corner markets, snatching up low priced produce before players can actually buy it and reselling it for a higher price. The only way for players to prevent their produce from being snagged like that is to set the price where the bot won't buy it. At that point the players themselves are selling it for way more.

    Inflation.

    Edit: I've already heard people mention that there are auction bots, though why anyone would bother in a game like Glitch is beyond me (ie the nature of the game itself is more cooperative than competitive).
    Posted 11 months ago by Valzemodeus Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Personally, I avoid auctions cuz I hate seeing when they are being manipulated. I like getting my produce from vendors.
    Posted 11 months ago by gimmegames Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Another advantage to vendors currently, is getting exactly the quantitiy you need, and no leftovers cluttering up valuable inventory space.
    Posted 11 months ago by gimmegames Subscriber! | Permalink
  • If bots took over the auctions, people could easily survive. No matter what, I am not buying spinach for 50 currants per. I will do without. The bots will not be able to control prices, becuase it takes a buyer to keep prices propped up. People with crop gardens will trade with those with herb gardens (as happens now) And while not eveyone can gather enough food for a day from one street's piggies, each meat is 10 energy points - there are enough pigs to keep everyone alive. Meat and spice are the key ingredients in MANY dishes. Rich tagine only takes meat, spice and onions for example. Ribs only take meat and spice.
    Posted 11 months ago by Kookaburra Subscriber! | Permalink
  • If this happens I would probably set a price cap for my self, if the price is lower than the cap buy, if higher then grow. I can not imagine growing and selling raw crops at auction only finished products like meals or hooch based drinks. Also without vendors it is theoretically possible for crop types to become extinct. If no one makes seeds from their potatoe crops because they are selling at 900c each and the buyers don't turn them into seeds it's possible for them to become scarce or even extinct. It's not likley but it is possible.
    Posted 11 months ago by Octo Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Crops are easy to grow - it won't be possible to corner the market on them with snipers.   Consider hooch - once players could make it the price at auction has fallen about as low as it can go.   If snipers could corner that market and force up the price, why have they not done so?   Because they would run out of money trying to buy up an endless supply of cheap hooch.   Once this happens they have to try to liquidate all that hooch at prices near or below what they were sniping it at.   

    There are only a few things at auction that sell for a premium over their "list price", and that is usually because they are difficult to produce and in relatively short supply.   Produce and tools do not fit that profile. 

     
    Posted 11 months ago by WalruZ Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Octo - hoarders (like me) will ensure there is never an extinction of a particular crop. The supply may be limited for a while, but if seeds are going for huge prices supply should quickly catch up.

    And currently meat auction prices are artificially propped up to 480 / stack, since that is how much the tool vendor will pay. Between public street being flooded w piggies & folks with harvesters I forsee the surplus to continue. My guess is stable meat price is really 280 - 300c once the vendors stop buying them.
    Posted 11 months ago by Sturminator IX Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I heard the word "marketplace" amidst stoot's answers yesterday... I think I like that word...
    Posted 11 months ago by gimmegames Subscriber! | Permalink
  • My guess is gardening will become something that is able to be done on a grand scale :P The fact that the related skill is called croppery seems to imply that just a tad. People have suggested tilling machines, sprinklers, and harvesting machines, and my guess is that something like them will make it in game. Especially once we are able to customize how many plots our gardens have at home :) 

    We don't know how group halls will work yet, so this next bit is complete speculation, but it is possible that in the future, if both group halls and marketplaces are implemented, that an Agricultural Association might create a hall dedicated to gardening plots that would have production around 100 plots or so, with machines, animals, or adorable robots to run them. Next they could acquire vendor-space in a marketplace and create a player run produce vendor :) At that point Innie's question would probably already have been addressed and we would no longer have game run produce vendors! And it would not be the end of the world :P

    All of the previous speculation is based on little hints and tidbits Stoot has dropped before, so it's not too crazy :)
    Posted 11 months ago by Liza Throttlebottom Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "demand still outweighs supply by quite a bit"

    So the price will rise, producers will enter the market and demand will fall, and soon equilibrium will be reached.  Hooray economics.
    Posted 11 months ago by Bellpepper Subscriber! | Permalink
  • +1 for Produce Vendor Removal

    However, I would like to see produce seeds sold by a vendor still because feed a piggy three times per a seed is really bad.
    Posted 11 months ago by Milolin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • For those who are saying you can survive just by nibbling meat -- remember, at the lower levels you only get 1 meat per nibble (and one nibble for each pig, right?).  It is REALLY difficult to survive on that, as you expend almost as much energy nibbling as you get from your nibble!

    At the lower levels when you first start, the produce vendor is a life-saver.  If produce goes to auction only and the prices are higher, new players might not be able to afford enough food to actually do anything energy intensive.
    Posted 11 months ago by Clarabelle Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Eh, but animal kinship 3 is a grand total of like two and a half hours. I have to say that they're the skills to prioritize. Though, I suppose concessions can be made for those that don't realize exactly what the skills are doing. And for now, even if the vendors are removed, auction prices will probably stay stable. The veges are simple to produce and are only good for cooking. Cooking is usually done for money, or extra energy, and if you're paying so much for veges that you're not making a profit, or net energy gain (since with food prices on auction and food value in general 1 energy equals 1 currant) then you won't buy.

    Soooooooo, overall I think new players would still be fine :) Food is relatively inexpensive and the leveling cash bonuses cover you for the first few hours of play. And by then you have the skills to be okay :P
    Posted 11 months ago by Liza Throttlebottom Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Personally, I do not eat food and never have. I dislike in game cooking and have more or less given it up. I only died once from hunger and that was early on and it was my fault for not paying attention to the meter. There are 'tricks' you can learn to boost your energy half way through a day. It is difficult in the beginning, but that's part of the game and it feels good when you build up to being able to survive more easily.

    My income is from auctioning the veg I grow. I don't use the vendors at all for produce or seeds, only the first time and then once more when I realised I had sold all my stock and forgotten to save enough seed

    I wish there was a way to sell mixed boxes for small scale cooks. It's not economical for me to put a lot of small auctions on but nobody wants, say, 50 cucumbers, so I stopped growing those. Or do away with the listing charge, it's small but the return I make on the stuff I auction is small enough anyway and the very few things I have sold to the vendors (perhaps three lots of crops) have been through the auction and returned.

    I have been here for a month or so and my currents are accumulating steadily. It is possible to live without vendors and I think they could go, as long as we are able to harvest or grow the few things they sell that we can't make at the moment.

    It would be better for growers if there was more demand for produce, I enjoy selling on auction, it feels more like participation than going to the vendor. I have made a few friends from supplying things like emergency spinach.

    I did come across a new player the other day who asked me for food, they were saying "help me, help me, I am going to die without food", it made me smile remembering when I was very new and I donated a few meats to keep them going. Maybe we could arrange food bank type places for the new players to collect some rations - would help those trying to get the badges too.
    Posted 11 months ago by Miss Parsley Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @ Milolin. You said.... feed a piggy three times per a seed is really bad.

    Three produce items to get one seed is quite high. I wish there were extra seeds as a bonus now and then. Also, it is a tedious business, especially when the piggies keep trying to run away.
    Posted 11 months ago by Miss Parsley Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "So the price will rise, producers will enter the market and demand will fall, and soon equilibrium will be reached.  Hooray economics."

    yeah, this grade school economics garbage has nothing to do with in-game economics. has precious little to do with real-world economics for that matter.

    why would producers enter the market? this assumes that there are enough producers *available* to enter the market. the number of producers hinges on the popularity of the game.

    it assumes that currants are useful enough for producers to want to collect them, instead of using their raw goods directly.

    it assumes that this new equilibrium, if achieved, would be *fun enough* for the producers to be sustainable in a game where if things stop being fun, people can just close a tab and vanish forever.

    so you are linking the ease with which, say, new players are able to play the game with the overall popularity of the game .. and further, the overall popularity of currants *within* the game.

    producers don't magically manifest simply because there is demand. that's an economic myth that, while widely held, is bunk. it is extra bunky when applied to MMOG economies. there are way, way more factors in play.
    Posted 11 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Miss Parsley, I think Milolin means it's bad because it's so tedious to get a garden's worth of seeds for growing, not that 3 produce for 1 seed is a bad ratio.

    If we were able to feed a pig 12 or 30 produce at once and get 4 or 10 packs of seeds, it'd not be such a pain and removing seeds from vendors wouldn't be a problem. But having to feed 3 at a time, over and over, just to get 12 or 16 plots worth of seeds, is terrible for those that like keeping a garden growing.

    Heck, being able to put specific produce in the piggy feeder and getting random piggy plops through out the day as they eat would make it a lot easier. I do not want to see seeds removed from vendors until they are a bit less tedious to obtain.
    Posted 11 months ago by Little Miss Giggles Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Little Miss Giggles, thanks for explaining that, I misunderstood.

    It is always my intention to keep feeding the pigs more than I need to, to make spare seeds, but I can never stand it past the point where i have enough to plant. It is incredibly tedious. Your idea about the pig feeder is a good one. I havent used one yet as I don't have the skill but it would make gardening a lot less of a chore.
    Posted 11 months ago by Miss Parsley Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Sure, no problem. :)

    I generally have had that intention too, but yea, it's too much a pain to execute. So usually I am lazy and just buy them. It is easier than it used to be now that we can put a specific amount in, so we don't have to do it one veggie at a time or have less than 18 veggies to be able to feed them 3 at a time anymore.
    Posted 11 months ago by Little Miss Giggles Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Yea, Little Miss Giggles explained better than I. :) Thanks LMG!
    Posted 11 months ago by Milolin Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "being able to put specific produce in the piggy feeder and getting random piggy plops through out the day as they eat would make it a lot easier"

    That needs to go into the Ideas forum, Little Miss Giggles!
    Posted 11 months ago by Innie✿, Obviously Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Yes it does, it is pretty awesome!
    Posted 11 months ago by Rook Subscriber! | Permalink
  • KEEP THE PRODUCE VENDOR
    ALL THE NEW PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO DO THERE MISSIONS WITH FOOD THEY CANT GROW THEY CANT GET A HOUSE SO NO DONT GET RID OF IT 
    Posted 11 months ago by zoey10189st Subscriber! | Permalink
  • KEEP THE PRODUCE VENDOR
    ALL THE NEW PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO DO THERE MISSIONS WITH FOOD THEY CANT GROW THEY CANT GET A HOUSE SO NO DONT GET RID OF IT 
    Posted 11 months ago by zoey10189st Subscriber! | Permalink
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