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OK OK put the game back now I've had a rest. Any longer and I'll have to address the pile of work to my right ;-)

Posted 19 months ago by James Backstab Subscriber! | Permalink

Replies

  • Haha I know the feeling.  I might have to actually pay attention to my Econ professor in class today :/
    Posted 19 months ago by Wessles Subscriber! | Permalink
  • likewise, was just thinking the same myself! been regularly [but covertly!] checking mi browser at work all day but no glitch... :( i think GOD said something in-game yesterday about the next session, but i was too busy massaging and milking butterflies!
    Posted 19 months ago by alfa23 Subscriber! | Permalink
  • The next test opening is not confirmed yet, but it definitely won't be today or tomorrow. So, you can relax the checking for a little while ;)
    Posted 19 months ago by stoot barfield Subscriber! | Permalink
  • It's a long weekend here. The one day I *can* play...I can't. :-(
    Posted 19 months ago by nonpromqueen Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Thanks Stoot, I am holding out my hopes to play before i go away Thursday!
    Posted 19 months ago by James Backstab Subscriber! | Permalink
  • i'm actually scared taht the game will open some time soon for full 24/7 play. you guys are doing something very very right to make this game as addicting as diet coke.
    Posted 19 months ago by greenkozi Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Haha, yeah, last week was a harsh week for me at work (I'm a social worker) and playing the game really helped lift my mood. And now I'm addicted. I need my Glitch-induced endorphins. :P
    Posted 19 months ago by Cerulean Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Hi. Thanks for Glitch.

    Is it the case that there's only one game process, such that it isn't possible to have the game running while writing and compiling the code? Even if there's just one server, it would seem it could be run on a different IP or port for testing, allowing users to continue playing, with only the occasional restart when new code needs the wider testing of the beta players.

    While the devs may not need a higher rate of error reporting, having the game open for play for longer, might encourage a better quality of testing- by which I mean people might be willing to do "silly" things, to root out corner cases and bugs that wouldn't show themselves when people are behaving more expectedly. I realise my guy is going to get wiped, and that I shouldn't care about progress...but I can't help it, and it inhibits me from trying out "wasteful" activities.

    Even if it is not possible for some strange reason, to run the game whilst actively developing, might it be possible to switch the game on for whatever constitutes dev downtime, i.e. overnight? Or are the devs too widely distributed in time and space for there to be any blocks of non-dev time?

    Again, thanks for your efforts!
    x
    Posted 19 months ago by beechamel Subscriber! | Permalink
  • The Tiny Speck development team is situated around the world. 

    And, personally, I like it that the tests only run when there are devs available and active in the Live Help.  Much less frustrating to be a tester when you can get immediate feedback from the developers.

    Why not do silly things right now, since everything is being wiped at the end of beta?  Seems like a good time to be really, really silly.  Sorry you are inhibiting yourself that way.
    Posted 19 months ago by WindBorn Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Well, right now I can't, because it's closed, of course.

    As I said, I know it's irrational, but with play so rationed, it's hard not to do what the game is encouraging us to do- build characters.

    Another help, which I know is being considered for a subscriber feature, is, in MMO-speak, alts, or alternative (or "other", if you're a pedant) characters. One could be sacrificial, given metaphorical short piers to take long walks off of*.

    If the code is written, it'll want testing, so would make sense to have that open to all beta testers, and only restricted to subscribers after the ribbon gets cut, in any case.

    ----
    * Or sent off to the shops to buy bubbles for spirit levels...though given bubbles grow on trees...
    Posted 19 months ago by beechamel Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I also imagine that they are not at full staff yet. I imagine they need folks dev (even if just one) while the game is up, just in case something horrible happens. And even for minor issue (say like there is something wrong with a project that needs to be fixed). And they need to sleep some time.
    In the mean, time I'm going to write an Ode to Awesome Stew.
    Posted 19 months ago by Lord Bacon-o Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I suspect that the TS development team is using agile development methods, and there is no code that is "all written".
    Posted 19 months ago by WindBorn Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @Windborn: If by that you mean nothing is ever truly finalised, then absolutely, you may well be right, even if the API gets locked(ish). But all code that isn't abandoned reaches a point where it is ready to be deployed, and ready to be beta tested by non-devs.

    As for agile development, that could imply active, "live" co-operation, which would mean that there would need to be the equivalent to office hours, and the corollary to that is time where there are no devs working on live code, even if they are doodling flowcharts in the bath.

    As m'lud says above, it might be that there's a policy of not running unless there are devs awake and in-game to some extent, to monitor and assist.

    I ask because I'm curious. I don't think I'm entitled to play, but if it could be run for longer, with code writing in parallel to the game running, then, heck...it might as well be so.
    Posted 19 months ago by beechamel Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @beechamel

    no, what I mean is that they are likely using agile development strategies rather than waterfall development strategies.   And why would you expect them to stop developing the API? 

    In the international agile teams that I've had experience with, there is no need for "office hours".  Development could be, and frequently was, taking place 24/7 around the world. 
    Posted 19 months ago by WindBorn Subscriber! | Permalink
  • trying so hard not to keep hitting refresh every... few seconds :)
    Posted 19 months ago by greenkozi Subscriber! | Permalink
  • yeah last chance to play until tuesday now. Hope it comes up!!!
    Posted 19 months ago by James Backstab Subscriber! | Permalink
  • With varients of agile development that involve (and most real life examples I've seen or been involved with, this has been the case) close co-ordination, or even pair-programming, you need to have at least some groups being active at the same time. Yes, you don't have to do it this way. Yes, even if you are organised along those lines, you could have people

    The reason for the quotes around office hours, if it wasn't clear, is that I'm not talking 9-5 GMT, but simply a more clumped activity schedule, which has the knock-on effect of clumping the dev (relative) inactivity, and ergo, allowing more gameplay.

    As for API freezes, that's the rule, not the exception. It what allows for the code ecosystem to develop. I'm not suggesting it needs to happen soon, or before there's enough playtesting to know if any code interface changes need to come in. Yes, you can extend the API in the future, but if you change what is being relied upon, that can become crippling to projects with many external modules, or distributed development, especially as the game matures and acquires hundreds of quests and thousands of items.

    I don't want to be getting into Lost-style guessing games, I only laid out some speculation with the hope of clarity being bestowed. I'm not after defending my guesses against counter guesses :)
    Posted 19 months ago by beechamel Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @beechamel
    In the past, I've seen this group of devs continue extending the API for years after the site went public.  I wouldn't expect them to change their practices here, since it seemed to be a philosophical approach to make the site more flexible without having the devs spend as much time on niche features.

    I was just surprised that you thought they were likely to change direction and freeze the API for this site. 
    Posted 19 months ago by WindBorn Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Their game, their testing timelines. Judging by the amount of changes they have put in just since Alpha ended, it obviously works well this way for them.
    Posted 19 months ago by Shwan Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I would expect any MMO game to extend for the lifetime of the game. You're always going to hit upon ideas for functionality which would be difficult to implement without API extensions.

    But if they don't stay backwards compatible, you run the risk of having to re-write more and more code as time goes by.

    But my point was that in locking down the core stuff, you can get to a deployable state, where non-core devs can work on things with a feeling of security that they won't have the foundations shift under their feet.

    If this is a change to their direction I wouldn't know, I'm new here, just not new to programming. If there are no such thing as core versus "outer" programmers, then things like this don't matter quite so much.

    Anyway, this is straying somewhat, and I wouldn't like it to look like I'm complaining or a malcontent. I'm merely curious about the things I originally posted.
    Posted 19 months ago by beechamel Subscriber! | Permalink
  • This has turned into a bit of a grudge match on experience of project methodologies!
    Posted 19 months ago by James Backstab Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @James: Don't think it's meant to be. I put forward some guesses, and then felt I had to defend what were actually questions, not statements. Such is the nature of the "lower half of the internet". Maybe I should have been softer in my line of enquiry, in case anyone thought I was a wrecker, to use an outdated expression from UK politics.
    Posted 19 months ago by beechamel Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I don't mean to stifle debate. just wish the game would come up ;-) 
    Posted 19 months ago by James Backstab Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Quick answer: we limit the amount of time the game is open because it takes a lot of manpower to tend to it and all the support requests that come from having it open. But it is only a matter of months before we're staffed up and the game is open 24/7, yay!
    Posted 19 months ago by eric Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @eric: Thanks for that clarificationette. So more or less, the devs switch from developing to GMing when it's running?

    It's not so sexy, but how is the GM control interface, and is it close to being possible for non-devs to GM, and therefore free you up to do the more specialised work? It's how it'll need to be when you've got a magnitude greater population. Seems like you have a lot of old hands in the playing community who I'm betting would see it as a privilege to do.
    Posted 19 months ago by beechamel Subscriber! | Permalink
  • beechamel, the engineers keep on being engineers when the game is open (they don't change into GMs). But, we are still testing things and so errors are found. And it is sometimes easier to fix things when there aren't people playing. It is not a technical limitation (we have many, many servers already and a development environment which is completely separate from production): the issue is that running the game takes time and energy and since we want to get enough done to say "1.0!!!!!" as quickly as possible, it is faster to not be testing all the time.
    Posted 19 months ago by stoot barfield Subscriber! | Permalink