Topic

Giant Favor Rollover Mechanics are Stupid

ok, so many of you have probably over donated to a shrine before and instead of speeding up a skill by three hours ended up wasting 10 thousand currants and picking up one redundant, useless emblem.

which is colossal over-punishment for dealing with a poor UI where the total favor counter is not present when actually donating - but at least the player has some control over it.

today i got into a situation where i donated below the cap, but that donation caused me to level, granting me favor, causing me to go over the cap, and i ended up with a useless emblem.

this system is totally frustrating from a number of angles, and should be done away with. the player should probably be asked whether they want an emblem or whether they want to speed a skill. if not that, then allow emblems to be donated back to the giant for favor.

Posted 15 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink

Replies

  • A few times I've miscalculated and gone over, getting an emblem instead of going just under in order to speed up learning. Yes its frustrating, I'm not much one for understanding programming, etc so not sure how hard it would be to implement into the system but it would be handy to have a "do you want a emblem or speed up learning" question rather then receiving the emblem automatically.
    Posted 15 months ago by BumbleBeez Subscriber! | Permalink
  • +1
    Posted 15 months ago by Downburst Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Ive had the same leveling problem on the past and agree with OP that this should change. I do, however, like the trial and error of not knowing how much favor items are worth. Adds a little experimentation:)
    Posted 15 months ago by Muncey Mango Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I would love it if we were given the option of choosing, though I'm not sure whether the inability to do so is intentional or not.

    If this is a petition, I sign it.
    Posted 15 months ago by Biohazard Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Probably simpler: what if the emblem itself could be spent to decrease learning time by the same amount?

    (Edit: yes, I meant "decrease", not "increase" ;)
    Posted 15 months ago by stoot barfield Subscriber! | Permalink
  • That would work, though I'd still like a favor count on the donating screen.  What I'd like most though would be donating X amount so I can donate more than 30 sparkly at a time without having to do the whole pile and going over.  Though the wouldn't be as big of a deal if favor rolled over after getting an emblem towards the next one.
    Posted 15 months ago by Hameigh Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @stoot barfield: I think your solution would be perfect. Simple, elegant, and wouldn't require the donation speech bubble+confirmation to get any more long or complicated.
    Posted 15 months ago by SleepyAce Subscriber! | Permalink
  • +1 for stoot's simple solution

    I know this problem and solution have previously come up in the forums.
    Posted 15 months ago by Becky Subscriber! | Permalink
  • "Probably simpler: what if the emblem itself could be spent to increase learning time by the same amount? Posted 32 min ago by stoot barfield"

    +1 definitely
    ETA: Shows how much I pay attention... +1 only if it's decrease not increase! lol
    Posted 15 months ago by BumbleBeez Subscriber! | Permalink
  • stoot: I guess you mean decrease learning time?
    Posted 15 months ago by Ximenez Subscriber! | Permalink
  • That would probably be a reasonable solution.  Emblems have been useless turds for a long time.

    This would allow you to not be locked in to a specific shrine while learning a given skill.  I actually don't want to play right now, because I don't want to accidentally gain any more favor that might push me over the emblem limit for the primary of my next skill.

    Even more annoying than striatic's example is the one where you've taken your level into account but are screwed by the random XP bonus.  Those things always make me nervous.

    If the value of the emblem is pegged at a static value, however, people will continue to be forced to play the same game...well, actually, I suppose it depends on the value.  But if they are worth, say, 1000 favor, you'd still be trying to undershoot so you don't blow 1300 or whatever favor to get 1000.
    Posted 15 months ago by Biff Beefbat Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I agree, it needs to be changed. I already got my first unwanted emblem today.
    Stoot's solution is generally decent, except for the quest where you have to spend exactly 997 favour towards the skill you're currently learning.
    Posted 15 months ago by Fussycat Subscriber! | Permalink
  • You could still do the 997 quest just fine, as long as you can still spend points normally.

    Which would make sense, because you don't always need over 1000 points on any given skill.
    Posted 15 months ago by Biff Beefbat Subscriber! | Permalink
  • +1 for stoot's idea - as long as he meant decrease learning time...not to mention - great thing to do with extra emblems!
    Posted 15 months ago by Firestone1960 Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @ Stoot: Love the idea :) as long as it will decrease the learning time!!!!!!
    Posted 15 months ago by 2020smoke Subscriber! | Permalink
  • The 997 quest worked for someone the other day spending 998, so I don't see why 1000 would be a problem :)
    It doesn't seem to require exactness.
    Posted 15 months ago by Biohazard Subscriber! | Permalink
  • love it stoot!  make it so! ...as a lesson in calculating giant favor, I enjoyed the 99.7% quest but the whole system is such a pain for all of us at times.  Why annoy ppl this way -- make emblems useful again! <3
    Posted 15 months ago by FlirtyvonSexenhaven Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I like being able to spend emblems but "by the same amount" would mean either tracking how much it went over and hiding the value in every emblem... or locking them to the max you can currently get from that shrine right now... and you could still ... say, donate 20 diamonds instead of 1, and over kill by 19 diamonds, and lose them.

    My "what if" solution has always been, "If an emblem would be awarded, generate a yes/no pop up that offers to give you the emblem."
    Posted 15 months ago by ICountFrom0 Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I have at least ten pot emblems in my bags. If I could use them for something other than a meager XP reward and the faint hope that once in a blue moon they may be useful in a Rook Attack, I would be ecstatic. Right now they're dead weight. I've been seeing how long I can go without buying a house after the reset ended and I lost my Kajuu mansion, and my primary incentive to get a cheap house is just so I can dump all of these pot emblems in there.
    Posted 15 months ago by The Crepeist Subscriber! | Permalink
  • +1 to this, as a new player this has been a source of confusion and aggravation. The solution sounds great.
    Posted 15 months ago by Zelgius Subscriber! | Permalink
  • +1!

    I'm almost to the point where I can spend the 997 from Lem and if I somehow go over and lose it and get another Emblem I'm going to snap, man! Even if said Lemblem speeds up my learnting I would still like to get that quest off my log.
    Posted 15 months ago by shipwreck Subscriber! | Permalink
  • +2. Because I'm worth it

    But seriously, I like the idea of spending the emblems to get the time increased. This way we can get the increase in amount to get an emblem (increases by 100 each time, right?) allowing more to be stored in future attempts without getting an emblem. Plus we can finally use/get rid of easily those emblems.... I love this idea!
    Posted 15 months ago by MiTYH Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I like the idea of sacrificing emblems to gain speed learning skills, but who cares about the random nature of donations. The gods should be random and I like that it isn't quite an exact science. I would also like to see certain gods preferring certain things. It would help to make donations more interesting. Or maybe giving specific requests similar to how street projects work.
    Posted 15 months ago by erik Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Another nice thing about being able to spend emblems to speed learning is that you would be able to save them up. Sometimes when I'm learning a long skill already as fast as I can, I want to do something with favor I'm storing up, but I can't (or donate a bunch of gems I picked up mining or music blocks or whatever).
    Posted 15 months ago by Niqster Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I would just like to echo Striatic's OP frustration and give a hearty here here +1 to Stoot's proposed solution, let's put him in charge of the whole game!!! ;)
    Posted 15 months ago by Keymo Machine Subscriber! | Permalink
  • there is one problem with the emblem "spend to increase learning speed" idea.

    the issue is that it happens outside the shrine UI, which gives feedback as to skill learning time limits.

    if you are learning a skill as fast as you can, the shrine indicates that.

    if you aren't learning a skill as fast as you can, the shrine will say "spend x favor to speed .." and if x is lower than your current favor, you know that donating anymore won't help so you might as well spend the points you have.

    spending the emblem to speed is a good idea and greatly improves the current situation. i think what will happen though, is people will spend emblems to speed in situations where it is overkill and most of the speed benefit is wasted when blowing past the speed cap .. or even situations where people over the speed cap spend an emblem to no effect.

    perhaps these issues could be addressed in the "are you sure you want to spend" dialog box.
    Posted 15 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • an interesting side effect of that idea, and i am not sure it is really a bad side effect or a good one, is that it would create a market for learning speed boosts.

    a player with lots of free time and a lot of shrine powder can generate emblems at fairly low cost. Cubimal Box + FHSP or Crystamalizing Chamber + EHSP or with a seriously pushed up cap, Cubimal Box + EHSP. that player could generate a bunch of emblems and sell them as learning speed boosts to lower level players.

    as a long term business i'm not use it would work very well, as earning emblems becomes more and more difficult with the increasing rollover target. interesting potential side effect though.
    Posted 15 months ago by striatic Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I was given a bag of emblems in beta and was able to use them to unlock skills and get the trophy.  

    Also. in beta, I went over the top on a shrine I was saving up for so I could complete the quest.   I went over without knowing where I got the extra favor from.  I figured the quest was set up to teach you how to notice where favor was coming from and where it was going so I didn't have a problem with it.  And since the meter rises to 1100 after you get an emblem its not so hard to do the 997 quest when the limit is 1100. 
    Posted 15 months ago by Treesa Subscriber! | Permalink
  • actually i'm going to go with Striatic's comment from another thread a long time ago about dying with a grinder.

    Dying when grinding is a lot like missing a jump and falling into a pit on mario. It's a game. There are pitfalls.

    Over-donating is another one of those pitfalls. Be a better player and work around the 'UI" and don't mess-up. It's on you, not the game, if you mess-up. Yes, the level-up thing was an interesting, rare situation. But you flubbed.
    Posted 15 months ago by Mr. Dawgg Subscriber! | Permalink
  • I got the 997 quest completed last night, but I had already received my first emblem. I like @stoot's idea of using the emblem to handle @striatic's problem. I could see other, similar, uses with it being a stand in for the shrine. Not for making donations, but at least a way to check favor with the related Giant, and to spend earned favor. For the last all they have to do for each additional emblem after the first is to leave the "Spend" option in the menu and have it apply the favor value of the Emblem to the currently learned skill - and have the Emblem go away like it does (with the same warning prompt) when you unlock higher skills. Most of the code for it should already be there :)
    Posted 15 months ago by Fokian Fool Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Mr Dawgg:   Its not a big deal for me but I've heard complaints from other players as well so its not just striatic's problem.  Also, if striatic can't keep an accurate score of how much favor he has with the powers that be then nobody can...
    Posted 15 months ago by Treesa Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Another +1 for emblem=learning time decreasers.  I've gotten two accidental extra emblems now...
    Posted 15 months ago by Jacaranda Subscriber! | Permalink
  • +11111 for the emblem learning decreaser.
    Posted 15 months ago by Tibbi Subscriber! | Permalink
  • @stoot - that would be *awesome*!!  :-D
    Posted 15 months ago by Reba Subscriber! | Permalink
  • If anyone has any spare emblems at the moment whose presence is reminding them of these dreadful irritations, I have none...so by all means mail them to me. I'd clearly be doing you a favour by taking them :-p
    Posted 15 months ago by Violet Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Dun duh dun! Due to popular demand, we've added a new twist to skill learning acceleration: you can now spend Emblems (rather than just stored favor) to speed up skill learning. 
    Posted 14 months ago by Blanky Subscriber! | Permalink
  • um, "devils advocate", isn't there a limit on how much you can speed up the learning process, so say you spend a emblem and are still able to increase speed, so you spend another one, but because you were close to the cap on learning speed you wasted that emblem... therefore i think it would be best to give players the option to or not to get an emblem or use the points towards speeding up the learning process.
    Posted 14 months ago by AtOddz Subscriber! | Permalink
  • AtOddz - that is true today for any large donation. I accidentially donated a humongous damond when I only needed 30 more favor points. I lost the rest. So sad. It was my only diamond. Live and learn. Just like real life.
    Posted 14 months ago by Kookaburra Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Spending Favor will speed it up to a certain point. Will the emblems contribute to this, or allow you to bypass this?
    Posted 14 months ago by Zu Subscriber! | Permalink
  • Nevermind:  Looks like spending emblems can be used in combination with favor points, but they will not help you if you are already learning as fast as you can through favor points alone. Yay!
    Posted 14 months ago by Zu Subscriber! | Permalink
  • +1
    Posted 14 months ago by Bruser Subscriber! | Permalink